Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 20

Thread: TWA Flight 800 by Nat Geo

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Oregon, IL
    Posts
    7,717

    TWA Flight 800 by Nat Geo



    Sounds plausible except they threw in the "...two miniscule pauses...each are 2 microseconds long." Even if you consider that the 2 microseconds could be a halfwave and we are looking at a response of 4uS on the tape, it would mean that the recording fidelity of the tape would need to be better than 250kHz. I can't buy that. 2 milliseconds I could buy. Maybe they misspoke.

  2. #2
    Orca Whisperer
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Buffalo, NY
    Posts
    22,593
    Quote Originally Posted by X-Rated View Post


    Sounds plausible except they threw in the "...two miniscule pauses...each are 2 microseconds long." Even if you consider that the 2 microseconds could be a halfwave and we are looking at a response of 4uS on the tape, it would mean that the recording fidelity of the tape would need to be better than 250kHz. I can't buy that. 2 milliseconds I could buy. Maybe they misspoke.
    I think they mispoke. 2 microseconds is imperceptible to the human ear as a "pause".
    Big Giant Meteor 2020 - We need to make Earth Great Again

    http://www.coreyreichle.com

  3. #3
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    9,698
    Quote Originally Posted by KC2UGV View Post
    I think they mispoke. 2 microseconds is imperceptible to the human ear as a "pause".
    It has nothing to do with what you can hear, it's the analyzing of missing data from the voice recorder. They believe the missing data segments coincide with the shorting of a power cable to the fuel level sensor in the tank.

  4. #4
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Oregon, IL
    Posts
    7,717
    Quote Originally Posted by N2KKM View Post
    It has nothing to do with what you can hear, it's the analyzing of missing data from the voice recorder. They believe the missing data segments coincide with the shorting of a power cable to the fuel level sensor in the tank.
    2uS on magnetic tape? I dare anyone to detect a 2uS pause on magnetic tape whether it is with any method you want. The tape response would have to be better than 500kHz actually.

  5. #5
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    9,698
    Quote Originally Posted by X-Rated View Post
    2uS on magnetic tape? I dare anyone to detect a 2uS pause on magnetic tape whether it is with any method you want. The tape response would have to be better than 500kHz actually.
    I realize that and I wasn't disagreeing with you. I was replying to Corey that it wasn't about hearing anything. Even though in this case the "pause" wouldn't be detectable if it was 2 uS, longer ones that may be detectable by waveform analysis of the recording might not be audible. I agree, it can't be 2 us. Even 2 ms would probably not be detectable by just listening though.

    That said, you'd have plenty of room on a video tape for that kind of response ;)
    Last edited by N2CHX; 01-07-2013 at 11:46 PM.

  6. #6
    Orca Whisperer
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Buffalo, NY
    Posts
    22,593
    Quote Originally Posted by N2KKM View Post
    It has nothing to do with what you can hear, it's the analyzing of missing data from the voice recorder. They believe the missing data segments coincide with the shorting of a power cable to the fuel level sensor in the tank.
    It would hardly be a "pause". 2us isn't even out of tempo for speech is my point. Even if they saw the waveform analysis, it wouldn't be called a pause. It would be normal tempo of syllables.
    Big Giant Meteor 2020 - We need to make Earth Great Again

    http://www.coreyreichle.com

  7. #7
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    9,698
    Quote Originally Posted by KC2UGV View Post
    It would hardly be a "pause". 2us isn't even out of tempo for speech is my point. Even if they saw the waveform analysis, it wouldn't be called a pause. It would be normal tempo of syllables.
    Haven't done a lot of waveform analysis, have ya? ;)

    I have, in both audio and RF. You most certainly would see it, because with any recording device, there is always ambient noise coming from various sources; microphones, amplifier stages, etc. It may not be a "pause" in terms of what you can hear, which is exactly what I said earlier, but if there is a loss of power to an amplifier stage or a microphone for example, you would most definitely see a change in a waveform analysis. This type of analysis of ambient noise is exactly how recordings are analyzed to determine if they are edited or not. It's really not as difficult as it might seem.

  8. #8
    Orca Whisperer
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Buffalo, NY
    Posts
    22,593
    Quote Originally Posted by N2KKM View Post
    Haven't done a lot of waveform analysis, have ya? ;)

    I have, in both audio and RF. You most certainly would see it, because with any recording device, there is always ambient noise coming from various sources; microphones, amplifier stages, etc. It may not be a "pause" in terms of what you can hear, which is exactly what I said earlier, but if there is a loss of power to an amplifier stage or a microphone for example, you would most definitely see a change in a waveform analysis. This type of analysis of ambient noise is exactly how recordings are analyzed to determine if they are edited or not. It's really not as difficult as it might seem.
    I'm positive you can see it in a waveform... What I am saying, 2 us is hardly a pause. It's less than a caught breath. It's within the normal syllabic pause range :)
    Big Giant Meteor 2020 - We need to make Earth Great Again

    http://www.coreyreichle.com

  9. #9
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Oregon, IL
    Posts
    7,717
    Quote Originally Posted by N2KKM View Post
    Haven't done a lot of waveform analysis, have ya? ;)

    I have, in both audio and RF. You most certainly would see it, because with any recording device, there is always ambient noise coming from various sources; microphones, amplifier stages, etc. It may not be a "pause" in terms of what you can hear, which is exactly what I said earlier, but if there is a loss of power to an amplifier stage or a microphone for example, you would most definitely see a change in a waveform analysis. This type of analysis of ambient noise is exactly how recordings are analyzed to determine if they are edited or not. It's really not as difficult as it might seem.
    Dunno if you viewed the video or not but the tape they showed from the black box was audio tape and the analysis they used certainly had 2 pauses that were audible.

  10. #10
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Oregon, IL
    Posts
    7,717
    Quote Originally Posted by N2KKM View Post
    Yes, I know. Jesus, stop being so serious. You did say, "I dare anyone to detect a 2uS pause on magnetic tape whether it is with any method you want" though. But I know, can't admit you might be wrong, especially if it means a chick is right, when it comes to technical stuff.
    You are right. I was thinking one instance and did not limit it.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •