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Thread: Bedbugs!!!!

  1. #21
    "Island Bartender" KG4CGC's Avatar
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    Just before beginning each lecture he takes a teaspoonful of DDT just to show how harmless it is to humans.
    Either that was not DDT or this story is full of holes.

    Acute toxicityDDT is moderately to slightly toxic to mammals. The acute oral LD50 ranges from 113-118 mg/kg in rats; 150-300 mg/kg in mice; 300 mg/kg in rabbits; 500-750 mg/kg in dogs; and >1,000 mg/kg in sheep and goats. DDT is less toxic to test animals exposed via the skin. The acute dermal LD50 for female rats is 2,510 mg/kg(10). DDT is categorised by the World Health Organisation as Class II "moderately hazardous"(11).
    It mainly affects the central and peripheral nervous systems, and the liver. Acute effects in humans exposed to low to moderate levels may include nausea, diarrhoea, increased liver enzyme activity, irritation of the eyes, nose and/or throat. At higher doses, tremors and convulsions are possible(12). Deaths from exposure to DDT are rare. Even in developing countries there have been few reported cases, especially when compared with organophosphate insecticides (see PN34 pp20-21). In 1994, one fatal poisoning was reported in the US involving a child who ingested one ounce (28g) of a 5% DDT and kerosene solution(13).
    Chronic effectsDDT has caused chronic effects on the nervous system, liver, kidneys, and immune systems in experimental animals. Dose levels at which effects were observed are at very much higher levels than those which may be typically encountered in humans(14). However they may be at, or even below, levels found in body fat (see below).
    Reproductive effectsDDT causes adverse reproductive effects in test animals. In one rat study, oral doses of 7.5 mg/kg/day for 36 weeks resulted in sterility. In rabbits, doses of 1 mg/kg/day administered on gestation days 4-7 resulted in decreased foetal weights. In mice, doses of 1.67 mg/kg/day resulted in decreased embryo implantation and irregularities in the oestrus cycle over 28 weeks(15). Many of these observations may be the result of disruptions to the endocrine (hormonal) system.
    Available epidemiological studies involving exposure to DDT have not confirmed adverse effects in humans. One study did report a significant association between maternal DDT blood levels and miscarriage, but the presence of other organochlorines in maternal blood, make it difficult to attribute the effect solely to DDT(16).
    Teratogenic effects (birth defects)
    Again there is evidence that DDT causes teratogenic effects in test animals. In mice, maternal doses of 26 mg/kg/day DDT from gestation through to lactation resulted in impaired learning in maze tests(17). Epidemiological studies involving humans are unavailable(18).
    CancerThe evidence relating to DDT and carcinogenicity provides uncertain conclusions. It has increased tumour production, mainly in the liver and lungs, in test animals such as rats, mice and hamsters in some studies, but not in others. In rats, liver tumours were induced in three studies at doses of 12.5 mg/kg/day over periods of 78 weeks to life, and thyroid tumours were induced at doses of 85 mg/kg/day over 78 weeks. Tests have shown laboratory mice were more sensitive to DDT. Life time doses of 0.4 mg/kg/day resulted in lung tumours in the second generation and leukaemia in the third generation, and liver tumours were induced at oral doses of 0.26 mg/kg/day in two separate studies over several generations(19).
    The US Department of Health and Human Services (DHHS) has determined that 'DDT may reasonably be anticipated to be a human carcinogen'. DHHS has not classified DDE and DDD, but the US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has determined that they are probable human carcinogens(20).
    Work carried out by the US National Cancer Institute correlates breast cancer in women with increased levels of DDE in blood serum. From 14,290 women monitored in the New York University Women's Health Study, researchers selected 58 women who had developed breast cancer and 171 matched controls without cancer. After adjusting for participants' childbearing and breast feeding histories, and for family history of breast cancer, researchers found a four-fold increase in relative risk of breast cancer for women with elevated levels of DDE in the blood(21).
    http://www.pan-uk.org/pestnews/Actives/ddt.htm




    http://www.ourstolenfuture.org/newsc...man/humepi.htm




    Here is one that say that DDT is safe but look at who published it.
    http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/tfacts35.html
    DDT affects the nervous system. People who accidentally swallowed large amounts of DDT became excitable and had tremors and seizures. These effects went away after the exposure stopped. No effects were seen in people who took small daily doses of DDT by capsule for 18 months.
    A study in humans showed that women who had high amounts of a form of DDE in their breast milk were unable to breast feed their babies for as long as women who had little DDE in the breast milk. Another study in humans showed that women who had high amounts of DDE in breast milk had an increased chance of having premature babies.
    In animals, short-term exposure to large amounts of DDT in food affected the nervous system, while long-term exposure to smaller amounts affected the liver. Also in animals, short-term oral exposure to small amounts of DDT or its breakdown products may also have harmful effects on reproduction.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by n2ize View Post
    I disagree. I feel it should be allowed to be used as a household pesticide. DDT is not nearly as harmful to the environment as it has been made out to be. Matter of fact, some of the chemicals which replaced DDT after it was banned were far more toxic and dangerous than DDT. Matter of fact there is a noted lecturer on the benefits of DDT. Just before beginning each lecture he takes a teaspoonful of DDT just to show how harmless it is to humans.
    It's not so much the toxicity to humans that was the problem. It was the environment impact of such widespread usage. Almost causing the extinction of our nation's national bird, among other species.
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  3. #23
    Silent Key Member 5-25-2015 W1GUH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KC2UGV View Post
    It's not so much the toxicity to humans that was the problem. It was the environment impact of such widespread usage. Almost causing the extinction of our nation's national bird, among other species.
    Which brings up the difficult question....

    Where do we stop pampering lesser species before it totally messes up our lives?
    If it's a war on drugs, then free the POW's.

  4. #24
    Orca Whisperer n2ize's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by W1GUH View Post
    Which brings up the difficult question....

    Where do we stop pampering lesser species before it totally messes up our lives?
    There has to be a "get tough" point somewhere. Unfortunately the radical environmentalism of the 60's and 70's left us in such a pansy state that we no longer kick ass anymore. All the good chemicals are gone. The bugs attack us and we tolerate it. It's time that we, as a nation, start growing a pair and start kicking butt once again. We need to kick ass. Back in the 1950's people knew how to kick butt. Farmers.. industry leaders, homeowners, housewives, and even little kids wouldn't hesitate to splatter the varmints with enough DDT to get the job done and squash the little buggers. They knew how to get tough. These day's we've set the "get tough" bar so high that it's unreachable. Time to stop being pansies and start acting like MEN!
    Last edited by n2ize; 09-01-2010 at 04:40 AM.
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  5. #25
    Silent Key Member 5-25-2015 W1GUH's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by n2ize View Post
    There has to be a "get tough" point somewhere. Unfortunately the radical environmentalism of the 60's and 70's left us in such a pansy state that we no longer kick ass anymore. All the good chemicals are gone. The bugs attack us and we tolerate it. It's time that we, as a nation, start growing a pair and start kicking butt once again. We need to kick ass. Back in the 1950's people knew how to kick butt. Farmers.. industry leaders, homeowners, housewives, and even little kids wouldn't hesitate to splatter the varmints with enough DDT to get the job done and squash the little buggers. They knew how to get tough. These day's we've set the "get tough" bar so high that it's unreachable. Time to stop being pansies and start acting like MEN!
    I don't know about you John, but I can't say for sure whether or not I was being sarcastic. It's true that we DO have to worry about the environment, but there are times when ya gotta wonder when too much is too much. IMHO, with this crisis, it'd be reasonable to bring back DDT on an ad hoc basis to deal with it. Presumably, in the right hands and in limited situation (e.g. bedbug infestations) there'd be minimal environmental impact.
    If it's a war on drugs, then free the POW's.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by W1GUH View Post
    Which brings up the difficult question....

    Where do we stop pampering lesser species before it totally messes up our lives?
    I'm not really sure what your definition of "lesser species" is. All species exists as parts of the entire whole. It's impossible to damage another species' survival without impacting our own.

    Quote Originally Posted by W1GUH View Post
    I don't know about you John, but I can't say for sure whether or not I was being sarcastic. It's true that we DO have to worry about the environment, but there are times when ya gotta wonder when too much is too much. IMHO, with this crisis, it'd be reasonable to bring back DDT on an ad hoc basis to deal with it. Presumably, in the right hands and in limited situation (e.g. bedbug infestations) there'd be minimal environmental impact.
    And with this I agree. DDT in the hands of licensed exterminators = Good thing. DDT in the hands of every swinging dick = Bad thing.
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  7. #27
    Orca Whisperer n2ize's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by W1GUH View Post
    I don't know about you John, but I can't say for sure whether or not I was being sarcastic. It's true that we DO have to worry about the environment, but there are times when ya gotta wonder when too much is too much. IMHO, with this crisis, it'd be reasonable to bring back DDT on an ad hoc basis to deal with it. Presumably, in the right hands and in limited situation (e.g. bedbug infestations) there'd be minimal environmental impact.
    I agree. We've become wimps in the sense that we are so petrified to do anything that someone might say is "environmentally incorrect". We have become pansies in that we are afraid to just say, "we need the damned DDT and we're gonna use it, like it or not". In the old days people weren't afraid like we are today. They were tough, we're the pansies.
    I keep my 2 feet on the ground, and my head in the twilight zone.

  8. #28
    Forum Addict w3bny's Avatar
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    There's always the popular line and will work every time...

    Kill it with FIRE!
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  9. #29
    Orca Whisperer n2ize's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KC2UGV View Post
    I'm not really sure what your definition of "lesser species" is. All species exists as parts of the entire whole. It's impossible to damage another species' survival without impacting our own.



    And with this I agree. DDT in the hands of licensed exterminators = Good thing. DDT in the hands of every swinging dick = Bad thing.
    The only bad thing is if we allow DDT to be used the way they did years ago where they used it to excess. Farmers were spraying it right and left and it was ending up in streams, rivers, lakes. Home owners using it to keep the moths off their clothes or to keep the roaches at bay weren't hurting the lakes. Legalize it for everybody but restrict it's widespread use in places where it can easily end up in the water.
    I keep my 2 feet on the ground, and my head in the twilight zone.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by n2ize View Post
    The only bad thing is if we allow DDT to be used the way they did years ago where they used it to excess. Farmers were spraying it right and left and it was ending up in streams, rivers, lakes. Home owners using it to keep the moths off their clothes or to keep the roaches at bay weren't hurting the lakes. Legalize it for everybody but restrict it's widespread use in places where it can easily end up in the water.
    What do you think happens when clothing treated with DDT get laundered?
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