It's Dead, Jim

So, come home from work a little late due to some last minute stuff that had to be taken care of.

First thing I notice is that we had a little more snow today. And Little Miss Field Day didn't bother to clean off the walk.

Second thing I notice is a lot of footprints from our front door to the next door neighbors. So, I ask LMFD if anyone stopped by.

"Yeah. Mr. Sabo (the neighbor) stopped over. He wanted to tell you they had to move the wire because they were cutting the tree again."

Uh oh.

"The wire" is the horizontal segment of my inverted "L", which runs... ran through a tree in the corner of his backyard, with his permission, and into the woods. That tree (which was mostly dead) got cut down a few days ago. The workers were back today to trim a different tree... which was nowhere near the L.

The vertical part of the L is an old Butternut HF2V that I pressed into service.

Yeah, you see where this is going...

The 2V had two wires attached at the top. One was the L. The other was a guy wire that held the antenna more-or-less vertical, due to the weight of the L.

So I walk in the backyard... and the guy wire is now horizontal, running about 6 feet overhead. So I follow it, past the 2V... and about five feet from the 2V is the top of the 2V. Torn off.

Spoke to the neighbors. Seems that when the workmen told Mr. Sabo that they had to "move the wire" (14 gauge stranded copper), he offered to simply cut it, figuring we could splice it later. But, no, they insisted, they just had to move it. Yeah. Move it. What I think happened was that the guy wire did it's job, not letting the antenna sway too far in the wrong direction, someone applied sufficient torque, and...

And they didn't notice the wire was now almost low enough to give them haircuts? Or that there was a big piece of aluminum tubing hanging from it?

Mr. Sabo was going to call the owner of the company, tell him I wanted to talk to him. I have a bad feeling about this... I called the phone number, got a "voice mailbox is full" message from Verizon... and the receipt from the company had no company name or info printed on it. I have a hunch this is a fly-by-night or running-on-a-shoestring outfit. I hope I'm wrong.

Now, the reality is that I probably have some spare parts to fix the antenna. I'm not looking to soak someone for a brand new vertical -- I could, and I won't turn down an offer, but I don't have to. I'm just highly irritated.

...and off of 160 and 75 phone for the time being, too.

Let's see, low 30's tomorrow? Great weather for antenna work. How much you want to bet I drop nuts and screws and tools in the snow?

* sigh *

Here's what I was looking at when I came home from work yesterday:
Attachment 11366
It's hard to tell in the picture, but it is just hanging there in the air.

Now, the good news is that the top section of aluminum is the same size (width and thickness) on both the HF2 and the HF6. The band news is that the top section on the HF6 is 3 feet long... 4 foot on the HF2. At least, as per my instruction sheets.

Spoke with my neighbor this morning. He's going to call his insurance carrier. However, I have the feeling he's going to "embellish" the story a little. I can't, and won't, have any party to that -- especially considering who I work for. I can honestly tell them that I wasn't home when it happened, and didn't see the accident, only the aftermath. Beyond that... I only know what I'm told.

Tomorrow is supposed to be a "warm" afternoon, mid 40's. I'm not doing anything before then. At the very least, the HF2 is coming down. I'll see what, if anything, I can do about repairs or replacements after that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by W3WN

How much you want to bet I drop nuts and screws and tools in the snow?

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That's a sucker's bet. No thanks. :hand:

Thanks Jim, knew I could count on you.

I'm going to call Butternut on Monday and order the two sections of aluminum. I could use the top section of the "parts" HF6 I have, but it would make the antenna a foot shorter... probably not enough to make a difference, electrically. Still, the cost of tubing shouldn't be that much (DX Engineering sells 6 foot lengths for under $7 each, so that's the backup if Butternut wants too much), and I'd rather restore it correctly.

Look at it this way. If you fix yours, and the insurance company does buy you another one, you can put them both up and have a phased array.

But, then, maybe not. Rumor has it, nothing phases you.

"How much you want to bet I drop nuts and screws and tools in the snow?"

How much you want to bet I drop my nuts and tool and screw in the snow?

There, that looks more like an Islander.

That sure looks like a mess, maybe you're too oriented to mitigating damages. If you can get replacements out of the deal go for it, that's what insurance is for. If your neighbor pads it that's between him and the insurance company, not your problem. Just because you're honest to a fault doesn't say you have any obligation to babysit him, babysitting just could be a fault.

Well, he's 80 something and not in the best of health. So what he says to his insurance agent, I don't want to know.

Whatever the replacement aluminum costs is all I'd want his insurance to pay me... or the tree trimmer's insurance, eventually. Anything beyond that... nah.

.


.
Reminds me of when I called in a professional

to trim a branch of the big oak in our back yard,

to make way for the NE leg of my 80 meter turnstile.

Charged me $100, which I considered reasonable.

His worker, on a ladder, up about 30 feet, gets the chainsaw wedged.

I lent him my electric chainsaw so he could free it.


P.S. We got about 2 inches of snow so far this morning.

Using a chainsaw to free a chainsaw, hmmm.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by W3WN

Well, he's 80 something and not in the best of health. So what he says to his insurance agent, I don't want to know.

Whatever the replacement aluminum costs is all I'd want his insurance to pay me... or the tree trimmer's insurance, eventually. Anything beyond that... nah.

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Shouldn't be an issue, especially if all you're asking for is the replacement parts, the liability is clear.

In SOME parts of the world, the claimant would be asking for a complete brand new antenna....

Sometimes Untied Parcel Service incompetence pays off. Once upon a time a friend ordered an antenna and after a couple of weeks hadn't received it. He called the seller and explained, having a great reputation to uphold they shipped another, this one arrived in a timely fashion. A month later he found the first one in the bushes, he gave it to me. Can't beat THAT price!

Dead nuts. Dead nuts sucks.

Unless they've reached room temperature, try a defibrillator at max power.

Replacement aluminum showed up today. That's the good news.

Neighbor stopped by. His insurance? Not doing a thing -- falls within the deductible. The tree trimmer? Says it didn't happen. So, he's willing to pay for the parts... and the boss tells me "absolutely not, you're not taking a penny from them."

Now... who didn't see all of that coming?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by W3WN

Replacement aluminum showed up today. That's the good news.

Neighbor stopped by. His insurance? Not doing a thing -- falls within the deductible. The tree trimmer? Says it didn't happen. So, he's willing to pay for the parts... and the boss tells me "absolutely not, you're not taking a penny from them."

Now... who didn't see all of that coming?

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My best advice is, listen to her. You won't be able to fix the antenna with a broken arm and a boot up your ass. Well, maybe, but it would be tough.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by W3WN

Replacement aluminum showed up today. That's the good news.

Neighbor stopped by. His insurance? Not doing a thing -- falls within the deductible. The tree trimmer? Says it didn't happen. So, he's willing to pay for the parts... and the boss tells me "absolutely not, you're not taking a penny from them."

Now... who didn't see all of that coming?

---

If it's a third party claim (you making the claim against his insurance) there shouldn't be any deductible. Sounds like there may be a miscommunication there or your neighbor doesn't want to make the claim.

From what you've said, the liability is pretty clear against the tree trimmer. He's the ultimate target. Commercial liability policies DO have a deductible sometimes, so maybe that's what your neighbor is talking about, but a deductible doesn't absolve anyone of responsibility.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by WU9G

If it's a third party claim (you making the claim against his insurance) there shouldn't be any deductible. Sounds like there may be a miscommunication there or your neighbor doesn't want to make the claim.

From what you've said, the liability is pretty clear against the tree trimmer. He's the ultimate target. Commercial liability policies DO have a deductible sometimes, so maybe that's what your neighbor is talking about, but a deductible doesn't absolve anyone of responsibility.

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All true. but the bottom line is that it's more aggravating to fight them over $50 in parts than my time and temper are worth. Which is what someone further up the food chain probably figures.

Now if the entire HF2V had been destroyed, that would be a different issue.

No, one must pick one's battles carefully, and this is one that I can't win; even if I "win" with the insurance company or the tree trimmer, I'll lose on the home front.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by W3WN

All true. but the bottom line is that it's more aggravating to fight them over $50 in parts than my time and temper are worth. Which is what someone further up the food chain probably figures.

Now if the entire HF2V had been destroyed, that would be a different issue.

No, one must pick one's battles carefully, and this is one that I can't win; even if I "win" with the insurance company or the tree trimmer, I'll lose on the home front.

---

Oh, I didn't realize the parts were that inexpensive. Yep, I would have done the same thing.

It was only the top two sections of aluminum tubing that were damaged. Possible only the topmost tube, but a small piece of it is still in the next tube down, and why take a risk?

I could have spent less. For about $20 including shipping, I could have bought the same OD diameter aluminum from DX Engineering, and in 6 foot lengths instead of 4. However, I would have also then had to cut and drill the tubes, and there's no guarantee that the thickness would be the same. Considering what an hour or so of my time is worth, it was worth it just to get the "factory" tubing.

At this point, I'm probably taking the entire HF2V down and putting it (after repairs) back into storage. I had been considering replacing it anyway, with about 40 feet of aluminum mast. Right now, I'm leaning that way... adding in some guy ropes. Also adding in a few 25 foot sections of "top loading" wires as part of the upper guys, as per a suggestion in the HF2 instructions from Don WØDN(SK), the creator of the antennas and the founder of Butternut. It will mean that this antenna will be primarily for 160, with a secondary use on 80/75. But that's OK, I don't need two 40 meter verticals, and the HF6 is working just fine (knock on plastic with woodgrain printing over sawdust and glue)

Picking your battles carefully is spot on. Picturing you trying to work with a boot up your ass is only funny from afar. Get to work on it soon or you'll miss the best weather for an antenna party.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by W3WN

Here's what I was looking at when I came home from work yesterday:
Attachment 11366
It's hard to tell in the picture, but it is just hanging there in the air.

Now, the good news is that the top section of aluminum is the same size (width and thickness) on both the HF2 and the HF6. The band news is that the top section on the HF6 is 3 feet long... 4 foot on the HF2. At least, as per my instruction sheets.

Spoke with my neighbor this morning. He's going to call his insurance carrier. However, I have the feeling he's going to "embellish" the story a little. I can't, and won't, have any party to that -- especially considering who I work for. I can honestly tell them that I wasn't home when it happened, and didn't see the accident, only the aftermath. Beyond that... I only know what I'm told.

Tomorrow is supposed to be a "warm" afternoon, mid 40's. I'm not doing anything before then. At the very least, the HF2 is coming down. I'll see what, if anything, I can do about repairs or replacements after that.

---

Let them pay for the cost of a new antenna + the cost of an electrician to install it even if you are the "electrician". Why pay when they can pay ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by W3WN

All true. but the bottom line is that it's more aggravating to fight them over $50 in parts than my time and temper are worth. Which is what someone further up the food chain probably figures.

Now if the entire HF2V had been destroyed, that would be a different issue.

No, one must pick one's battles carefully, and this is one that I can't win; even if I "win" with the insurance company or the tree trimmer, I'll lose on the home front.

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Tell them the antenna was destroyed and must be replaced. New antenna's are expensive. Some run into the hundreds of dollars. I think you know where I am going with this... ;)