hara not signing leases...

[n6hcm]

http://wdtn.com/2016/07/26/hara-arenas-hockey-team-to-go-dormant-for-season/

[n6hcm]

name of the hockey team is icing on the cake.

[KG4NEL]

Subliminal messaging.

That isn't working.

[n6hcm]

"2 NEWS reached out to Hara Arena for comment. We were told the facility will make an announcement in August, but officials declined comment for now."

something to give us all a break from election coverage ...

[KD8TUT]

Well if this is the end- at least I made it once.

Might be Friedrichshafen for me.

[kb2vxa]

Dayton Demolition, an ARRL sponsored hamvention.

Friedrichshafen, complete with a Zeppelin museum and inspiration to build an extended double Zepp antenna.

[W3WN]

Ok, so this news story has been floating around for over a week now. It's been discussed to death Over Yonder, on eHam, and now it's starting up on some of the email reflectors.

I need to point out, once again, ad infinitum ad nauseum, that the actual hard core facts are few.

The facts are...

The hockey team was unable to come to terms with HARA for a lease for next season. We do not know why.

The owner of the team alleges that others are also having problems with HARA signing leases. He does not say how he knows this.

HARA ownership/management has declined comment, and neither confirms nor denies the story & allegations. They do say they plan to make an announcement next month.

Those are the facts. Anything else is mere speculation at best.

Oh, almost forgot. There is one other fact, which a friend of mine (who was a member of the DARA Board of Directors and is one one of the people who run Hamvention for DARA) confirmed last May... DARA already has a lease for the HARA Arena for the next few years.

So what is really going on?

Damned if I know.

I have dropped an email to my friend and asked him for any appropriate comments. If he responds, and gives me permission to make his comments public, I will do so.

[KD8TUT]

Ok, so this news story has been floating around for over a week now. It's been discussed to death Over Yonder, on eHam, and now it's starting up on some of the email reflectors.

I need to point out, once again, ad infinitum ad nauseum, that the actual hard core facts are few.

The facts are...

The hockey team was unable to come to terms with HARA for a lease for next season. We do not know why.

The owner of the team alleges that others are also having problems with HARA signing leases. He does not say how he knows this.

HARA ownership/management has declined comment, and neither confirms nor denies the story & allegations. They do say they plan to make an announcement next month.

Those are the facts. Anything else is mere speculation at best.

Oh, almost forgot. There is one other fact, which a friend of mine (who was a member of the DARA Board of Directors and is one one of the people who run Hamvention for DARA) confirmed last May... DARA already has a lease for the HARA Arena for the next few years.

So what is really going on?

Damned if I know.

I have dropped an email to my friend and asked him for any appropriate comments. If he responds, and gives me permission to make his comments public, I will do so.

I consider that good news. I like HARA.

Will be there next year depending on some surgery dates. My wife and I are aslready chomping at the bit having missed this year due to the death of her mother.

[NA4BH]

It's a Canadian sport. Bushtit.

[VE7DCW]

It's a Canadian sport. Bushtit.

A Canadian sport played by Bushtit's?? maybe...... :clap:

[KG4NEL]

I'd rather go to Deutschland.

Deutschland, Deutschland uber alles...

[n6hcm]

Ok, so this news story has been floating around for over a week now. It's been discussed to death Over Yonder, on eHam, and now it's starting up on some of the email reflectors.

I need to point out, once again, ad infinitum ad nauseum, that the actual hard core facts are few.



right. and the facts you cited are in the article i shared.

[W3WN]

right. and the facts you cited are in the article i shared.
I know. Too bad so many of the Chicken Little types Over Yonder haw a reading comprehension issue.

[KD8TUT]

Apparently DARA has announced that the arena is closing and there is a contingency plan for the future.

Regarding HARA: It's dead Jim.

[KK4AMI]

WĎTN just announced that Hara is closing after 50 years because of family money squabbles. That is sad. Got my first hernia (r-390) there.

First Dayton dumps the ATA and the Grand American Trap Shoot, now they are likely to lose the Hamvention. What is next, tell the Air Force Museum to go take a hike? They are literally going to nail the coffin shut from the inside on their economy.

[W3WN]

Yeah, just got the word.

Here's one link: http://wdtn.com/2016/07/29/hara-arena-to-shut-down/
Here's another: http://www.arrl.org/news/good-bye-hara-arena-hamvention-to-relocate-in-2017

My friend in DARA filled me in last May on some of the legal squabbles. It's all summed up very nicely in the 4th paragraph, referring to the press release from the family. I guess the details no longer matter.

Looks like they'll be exercising their contingency plan now.

And everyone who griped about HARA & wanted it demolished just got their wish. Hope they're ready for what comes next.

My gut hunch is that while Hamvention may continue, it will take years -- if ever -- for DARA to recover from a change of venue. Not that they have much of a choice.

[NQ6U]

WĎTN just announced that Hara is closing after 50 years because of family money squabbles. That is sad. Got my first hernia (r-390) there.

First Dayton dumps the ATA and the Grand American Trap Shoot, now they are likely to lose the Hamvention. What is next, tell the Air Force Museum to go take a hike? They are literally going to nail the coffin shut from the inside on their economy.

Dayton didn't dump anything. HARA is a privately held company that's going under. One would think a free-market enthusiast like yourself would understand that.

[KD8TUT]

Man... what a loss. I dreamed of attending Hamvention ever since I was a kid. Thankfully I went in 2015. I guess once will have to be enough.

[WZ7U]

Oh well. I've had the chance to go since being made aware of it in '96. Never went though, couldn't justify the cost from cn86. Ain't made of money here!

Some part of me will always wonder what it was like though. Family legal squabbles; figures that's the arch issue (besides the gubmint wanting their 'cut').

I suppose SEAPAC will have to do. Yawn

[KD8TUT]

Oh well. I've had the chance to go since being made aware of it in '96. Never went though, couldn't justify the cost from cn86. Ain't made of money here!

Some part of me will always wonder what it was like though. Family legal squabbles; figures that's the arch issue (besides the gubmint wanting their 'cut').

I suppose SEAPAC will have to do. Yawn

It was like being washed over with history for me. When I think of the brilliant people who passed through those halls I'm in awe.

But it will continue elsewhere. BTW- I'm a YL member as well: 17135

[W2NAP]

Yeah, just got the word.

Here's one link: http://wdtn.com/2016/07/29/hara-arena-to-shut-down/
Here's another: http://www.arrl.org/news/good-bye-hara-arena-hamvention-to-relocate-in-2017

My friend in DARA filled me in last May on some of the legal squabbles. It's all summed up very nicely in the 4th paragraph, referring to the press release from the family. I guess the details no longer matter.

Looks like they'll be exercising their contingency plan now.

And everyone who griped about HARA & wanted it demolished just got their wish. Hope they're ready for what comes next.

My gut hunch is that while Hamvention may continue, it will take years -- if ever -- for DARA to recover from a change of venue. Not that they have much of a choice.

tell your DARA friend Indianapolis is right down the road. it would be welcomed here

[X-Rated]

tell your DARA friend Indianapolis is right down the road. it would be welcomed here

Now is the time for some enterprising ham club to step up to the plate and create the new worlds largest hamvention. I doubt DARA would want to stray far from the Dayton area.

[n6hcm]

And everyone who griped about HARA & wanted it demolished just got their wish. Hope they're ready for what comes next.

well, next year will certainly be a challenge even if everything goes smoothly (because it won't be what's happened for the past N decades and people will bitch). it will be excruciatingly clear to DARA that you can't make everyone happy. depending on what the new sitch looks like i'd kinda like to go ...

[W3WN]

Now is the time for some enterprising ham club to step up to the plate and create the new worlds largest hamvention. I doubt DARA would want to stray far from the Dayton area.
Yup.

DARA draws on a lot of volunteers and members, most of whom (the members, that is, not necessarily the volunteers) come from the Dayton/Miami Valley area or immediate vicinity. So to relocate Hamvention too far away from Dayton proper means that you start losing your helpers.

I don't think most of those who've been kvetching about the location and demanding a move to Orlando, Vegas, or other points more than an hour or so from Dayton proper realize this. (Or care, for that matter, most of them still won't go anyway)

That being said, I've heard for years how Las Vegas would be the PERFECT place to hold a new 'Hamvention-type' event. You'd think if that was the case, someone would have done the legwork by now. No one has. So what does that tell you?

[KG4CGC]

I guess now that makes Shelby Number 1.

[KD8TUT]

Yup.

DARA draws on a lot of volunteers and members, most of whom (the members, that is, not necessarily the volunteers) come from the Dayton/Miami Valley area or immediate vicinity. So to relocate Hamvention too far away from Dayton proper means that you start losing your helpers.

I don't think most of those who've been kvetching about the location and demanding a move to Orlando, Vegas, or other points more than an hour or so from Dayton proper realize this. (Or care, for that matter, most of them still won't go anyway)

That being said, I've heard for years how Las Vegas would be the PERFECT place to hold a new 'Hamvention-type' event. You'd think if that was the case, someone would have done the legwork by now. No one has. So what does that tell you?

Vegas... hate it. One place I hope to never visit. <shiver>

[W2NAP]

Yup.

DARA draws on a lot of volunteers and members, most of whom (the members, that is, not necessarily the volunteers) come from the Dayton/Miami Valley area or immediate vicinity. So to relocate Hamvention too far away from Dayton proper means that you start losing your helpers.

I don't think most of those who've been kvetching about the location and demanding a move to Orlando, Vegas, or other points more than an hour or so from Dayton proper realize this. (Or care, for that matter, most of them still won't go anyway)

That being said, I've heard for years how Las Vegas would be the PERFECT place to hold a new 'Hamvention-type' event. You'd think if that was the case, someone would have done the legwork by now. No one has. So what does that tell you?

in all honesty, Indianapolis would be a better pick, it is only a hour and a half away from Dayton. but Indianapolis has experience in dealing with large events.

[KK4AMI]

I really do think they are trying to keep it around Dayton. The Nutter Center at Wright State University might be a possibility if it's not too expensive.

[kb2vxa]

The NUTTER Center? Uh oh........

[KK4AMI]

The NUTTER Center? Uh oh........

I'm always there to pitch the "straight" lines.

[WZ7U]

Pppppfffffffffftttttttttt splash

<cleaning up spit up coffee from everywhere>

You would think I would know better than to drink coffee while reading posts. But noooo.

[n6hcm]

in all honesty, Indianapolis would be a better pick

honestly? chicago would be an even better pick. another few hours from dayton but more convenient for anyone flying in.

but neither are in the cards since it's dara's event.

[n6hcm]

I really do think they are trying to keep it around Dayton. The Nutter Center at Wright State University might be a possibility if it's not too expensive.

from all the speculation out there it sounds like the nutter center isn't sufficient by itself to offer the same sort of experience (i guess there are no sewage geysers there) ... something about parking, and the flea market ... so if they went this way there'd have to be shuttle buses, and this seems to piss people off.

also, it will never be as cheap as it was again. so there's that.

[n6hcm]

That being said, I've heard for years how Las Vegas would be the PERFECT place to hold a new 'Hamvention-type' event. You'd think if that was the case, someone would have done the legwork by now. No one has. So what does that tell you?

there used to be one in the 1960s and 1970s called SAROC ... the answer to your question, as you probably suspect, is people.

the obvious potential tie-in would be to have it alongside NAB, but this already fills the strip and rooms will be at a premium.

there's not even an amateur radio vendor in LV anymore (not since AES shut down anyway).

[W2NAP]

honestly? chicago would be an even better pick. another few hours from dayton but more convenient for anyone flying in.

but neither are in the cards since it's dara's event.

Chicago? fogetaboutit. Indianapolis would still be better, we handle big events really well, id say better then Chicago can.

[n6hcm]

Chicago? fogetaboutit.

the events i attend in chicago are 30k people, and they happen just fine.
i don't love chicago for other reasons (shitty weather all year 'round) but that has more to do with sf's unique climate and my preference for it.

indy wouldn't be awful ... i haven't been there since the late 1980s.

[W2NAP]

the events i attend in chicago are 30k people, and they happen just fine.
i don't love chicago for other reasons (shitty weather all year 'round) but that has more to do with sf's unique climate and my preference for it.

indy wouldn't be awful ... i haven't been there since the late 1980s.

Indy hosts the Indy 500 and Brickyard 400 every year 300K+ people events, so hamvention would be easy

[NQ6U]

Indy hosts the Indy 500 and Brickyard 400 every year 300K+ people events, so hamvention would be easy

But, it's in Indiana, which is not a very friendly place to a lot of people—including a number of Islanders—thanks to Gov. Mike Pence.

[W2NAP]

But, it's in Indiana, which is not a very friendly place to a lot of people—including a number of Islanders—thanks to Gov. Mike Pence.

it is friendly, most people here don't give a shit what people do in their private love lives. we got a few extreme wacko, but you can find them in every state

[NQ6U]

it is friendly, most people here don't give a shit what people do in their private love lives. we got a few extreme wacko, but you can find them in every state

I beg to differ.

While you can indeed find extreme wackos in every state, only a few states—including Indiana—have gone so far as to codify their wacko-dom into law. Besides, if, as you say, most Hoosiers don't give a shit, why do they repeatedly elect public officials like Pence?

[W2NAP]

I beg to differ.

While you can indeed find extreme wackos in every state, only a few states—including Indiana—have gone so far as to codify their wacko-dom into law. Besides, if, as you say, most Hoosiers don't give a shit, why do they repeatedly elect public officials like Pence?

better then the other guy. but there is many who would be better then any of the current politicians, however none of them will run for office

[WØTKX]

Given a combo of airline hubs, weather, and decent convention centers, Salt Lake City might be a good one.

But Chicago would be pretty cool. I used to "do" conventions there, mostly McCormick Place.

It's a great city. Even if Mama Batt's is long gone. I loved that restaurant!

[KD8TUT]

Looks like Hamvention will be held here:

http://www.greenecountyfairgrounds.com/index

Not so sure I'm excited.

[KD8TUT]

20 minute ride from Dayton...

Not so excited.

[KD8TUT]

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.6979428,-83.9391987,3a,75y,7.44h,90t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sqvVDXms1ZEMokwHcIfvegQ!2e0!6s% 2F%2Fgeo1.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DqvVDXms1ZEMok wHcIfvegQ%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_ sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26y aw%3D5.739994%26pitch%3D0!7i13312!8i6656

[NQ6U]

Looks like Hamvention will be held here:

http://www.greenecountyfairgrounds.com/index

Not so sure I'm excited.

But it's got a race track! Finally, a place to hold those Hoveround races we've all been dreamin' of!

[KD8TUT]

But it's got a race track! Finally, a place to hold those Hoveround races we've all been dreamin' of!

And every hotel in town is a shithole.

[KD8TUT]

Crap- I guess I'm going... my wife already made reservations for one of the local hotels because she saw my facebook post on it.

[N8YX]

But it's got a race track! Finally, a place to hold those Hoveround races we've all been dreamin' of!
I replied elsewhere to a Dayton thread, but...if they want a good venue at which to host this they ought to consider the Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course in Lexington. The track owners are used to dealing with swap-meet animalsa large collection of vintage equipment enthusiasts, there's enough real estate available that Luso could actually erect their 120ft portable tower...the timing tower seminar room and the Mid-Ohio School classrooms could be used for the various seminars, presentations and license exams. New equipment vendors and the various demo booths would have their choice of setting up in stalls on Pit Row, in self-provided exhibition tents in the paddock area adjacent to it or in same across the access bridge in the infield area.

From someone who's attended both locations for years for different events, the outdoor setup is definitely the way to go. No more wet-dog/wet-ass BO as was prevalent inside Hara. I wish I had the money to buy Mid-Ohio and do a little revamp on it so as to bring back the Superbike series...maybe convince AHMRA to return.

[NQ6U]

Obviously, the city officials of Xenia, OH, know nothing about ham radio operators...

http://www.arrl.org/news/view/city-of-xenia-greene-county-ohio-officials-ready-to-welcome-hamvention-in-2017

[W3WN]

News is out... The new site for Hamvention is the Greene County Fair & Exposition Center in Xenia, OH. About 30 minutes Southeast of Dayton proper.

Read the details at www.w8bi.org (http://www.w8bi.org) or www.hamvention.org (http://www.hamvention.org)

The site is smaller, and there are some questions about the flea market and parking.

Smaller is not necessarily bad, considering how relatively empty the arena itself and the flea market were compared to years past.

[KD8TUT]

Obviously, the city officials of Xenia, OH, know nothing about ham radio operators...

http://www.arrl.org/news/view/city-of-xenia-greene-county-ohio-officials-ready-to-welcome-hamvention-in-2017

Yes...

I've been looking at the sat images and street view. There's only two hotels in Xenia. If 25000 people show up- that town is in for a real jolt.

The road infrastructure to service that kind of traffic isn't there either. And two of the biggest buildings are not air conditioned.

[KK4AMI]

Yes...

I've been looking at the sat images and street view. There's only two hotels in Xenia. If 25000 people show up- that town is in for a real jolt.



The road infrastructure to service that kind of traffic isn't there either. And two of the biggest buildings are not air conditioned.

Beavercreek is nearby with plenty of hotels to support WPAFB.

[K7SGJ]

Yes...

I've been looking at the sat images and street view. There's only two hotels in Xenia. If 25000 people show up- that town is in for a real jolt.

The road infrastructure to service that kind of traffic isn't there either. And two of the biggest buildings are not air conditioned.


And their only cop is going to go crazy directing all the traffic. They might have to deputize an extra person.

[KD8TUT]

And their only cop is going to go crazy directing all the traffic. They might have to deputize an extra person.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9efgLHgsBmM

[KD8TUT]

Beavercreek is nearby with plenty of hotels to support WPAFB.

Well we got into the Ramada this afternoon. With a backup reservation at another place in town. So thankfully we'll be 5 minutes from the event.

Wasn't going to go then the wife decided we were going. *shrug*

[K4PIH]

And their only cop is going to go crazy directing all the traffic. They might have to deputize an extra person.

Deputize or euthanize?

[XE1/N5AL]

It will be interesting to see how next year's Hamvention is accepted. I wonder if this is a permanent move, or just a temporary measure until something else can be arranged. I hope they don't try to utilize the livestock areas.

I once went to a hamfest that was held at the livestock pavilion of some local fairground. A few of the unwashed attendees handily masked any residual animal smells, so that wasn't a problem. The big problem was the dirt floor. Shuffling feet kicked up quite a lot of dust that was depositing itself in thick layers on the fleamarket vendor offerings. So, all the vendors had to cover up their gear with plastic sheets, which defeated the whole purpose of having something on display.

[W3WN]

I wouldn't worry about the "livestock areas".

A local club (not mine) holds their annual hamfest at their county's Fair Grounds. There are quite a few barns and livestock areas... but the hamfest uses the larger of two general purpose (non agricultural) exhibit halls. With a nice thick concrete floor, I might add.

(One of our infrequent members can vouch for this, since it's his club's hamfest!)

So don't let the term "fairgrounds" mislead you.

[n6hcm]

Indy hosts the Indy 500 and Brickyard 400 every year 300K+ people events, so hamvention would be easy

uh, yeah (and they did that when i lived there too) but those people also spend money. hams don't spend money.

[W3WN]

If hams don't spend money, why do the local papers claim that Hamvention is worth ~$17 million annually to the local economy?

[XE1/N5AL]

Indy hosts the Indy 500 and Brickyard 400 every year 300K+ people events, so hamvention would be easyuh, yeah (and they did that when i lived there too) but those people also spend money. hams don't spend money.

I would spend money to see Indy Hamvention scooter racing!

[WØTKX]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1z43muPetNc

[WØTKX]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxeMFc_VjkY

[XE1/N5AL]

If hams don't spend money, why do the local papers claim that Hamvention is worth ~$17 million annually to the local economy?

Yes, income from lodging, restaurants, locally purchased gasoline, collected taxes, facilities rental, miscellaneous purchases, etc. all adds up.