Phone?

[K9CCH]

Do people still use the auto patch phone feature in amateur radio?

I remember when I first got my license and got into my first fender bender, the police officer allowed me to use his radio to call my mother. I had no idea what it was, or how it was done, but now that I'm reading up on it I realized that's what I was doing.

What circumstances would you use phone, aside from not having your cell phone, or having the cell towers jammed in emergencies/disasters? Those two are obvious.

[W4GPL]

I can't think of any compelling reason to use a phone patch if mobile phone service was working. I've heard a few guys use it recently -- I suppose they just like the nostalgia? Back when mobile phones were very expensive, you used to hear them used all the time.

[K9CCH]

So basically its not like there's old guys yakkin it up 3 minutes at a time then? On a regular basis, I should add....

[W4GPL]

Yeah.. it's pretty rare.

[NQ6U]

Only one autopatch left in San Diego County, on the Sharp Hospital repeater. No one is really sure why it's still there.

[W4GPL]

Only one autopatch left in San Diego County, on the Sharp Hospital repeater. No one is really sure why it's still there.If mobile phone service is every impacted, and land lines stay up and running, I'm sure it'll get used... never hurts to have a back up solution, I suppose.

[K9CCH]

There are tons of VHF repeaters around here with autopatch abilities. I should try one sometime soon.

[W4GPL]

There are tons of VHF repeaters around here with autopatch abilities. I should try one sometime soon.I betcha a lot of them just forgot to update their repeater directory listing. ;) But sure.. give it a try, it's neat. But full duplex mobile phones are MUCH better. :)

[K9CCH]

Yeah... but they don't have this cool 14" whip antenna on them.

[Bubba]

I betcha a lot of them just forgot to update their repeater directory listing. ;) But sure.. give it a try, it's neat. But full duplex mobile phones are MUCH better. :)


Full duplex mobile phones ? Where do you get one of those ?? :lol:
http://www.zoominto.com/zoomapi/ZoomButt.gif

[KC2UGV]

If I was a missionary in Africa on a tax-free vacation, so I could get free sat phone-like service.

[WØTKX]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duplex_(telecommunications)


A duplex communication system (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communication_system) is a point-to-point (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Point-to-point_(telecommunications)) system composed of two connected parties or devices that can communicate with one another in both directions, simultaneously. An example of a duplex device is a telephone (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone). The people at both ends of a telephone call can speak at the same time, the earphone can reproduce the speech of the other person as the microphone transmits the speech of the local person, because there is a two-way communication channel between them.




A half-duplex (HDX) system provides communication in both directions, but only one direction at a time (not simultaneously). Typically, once a party begins receiving a signal, it must wait for the transmitter to stop transmitting, before replying (antennas are of trans-receiver type in these devices, so as to transmit and receive the signal as well).An example of a half-duplex system is a two-party system such as a walkie-talkie (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walkie-talkie), wherein one must use "Over" or another previously designated command to indicate the end of transmission, and ensure that only one party transmits at a time, because both parties transmit and receive on the same frequency.
A good analogy for a half-duplex system would be a one-lane road with traffic controllers at each end. Traffic can flow in both directions, but only one direction at a time, regulated by the traffic controllers.

[kb2vxa]

Don't look now but you can do full duplex autopatch if you modify your rig to operate like the 150MHz VHF mobile phones did.

FYI, whomever wrote what is quoted above is confused, that describes simplex; transmitting and receiving on the same frequency while half duplex is the way a transceiver works into a repeater. That is to say transmitting on one frequency and receiving on another but only one at a time, while the repeater operates in full duplex mode. Oh not for you old buzzards, this is for the newbies in need of elmers.

[K7SGJ]

Don't look now but you can do full duplex autopatch if you modify your rig to operate like the 150MHz VHF mobile phones did.

FYI, whomever wrote what is quoted above is confused, that describes simplex; transmitting and receiving on the same frequency while half duplex is the way a transceiver works into a repeater. That is to say transmitting on one frequency and receiving on another but only one at a time, while the repeater operates in full duplex mode. Oh not for you old buzzards, this is for the newbies in need of elmers.

Yuuuuuuup. That's the glue that binds us.

[WØTKX]

Not exactly. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simplex_communication


ANSI definition: One way signaling[edit (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Simplex_communication&action=edit&section=1)]According to the ANSI (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_National_Standards_Institute) definition, a simplex circuit (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simplex_circuit) is one where all signals can flow in only one direction. These systems are often employed in broadcast networks, where the receivers do not need to send any data back to the transmitter/broadcaster.
Examples[edit (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Simplex_communication&action=edit&section=2)]

Commercial radio (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio) and television (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Television) broadcast (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadcast) (not two-way radio (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-way_radio) such as walkie-talkies)
Garage door openers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garage_door_opener)
Baby monitors (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_monitor)
Wireless microphones (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireless_microphone)
Radio controlled models (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_controlled_model)
Public address systems (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_address_system)
Surveillance cameras (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surveillance_camera)
Pagers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pager)
Communication between a mouse (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_mouse) or a game controller (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_controller) and a computer
Internet multicast (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IP_Multicast)
Radio navigation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_navigation) beacons and radiolocation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiolocation) services such as GPS (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_positioning_system)
Telemetry (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telemetry)

ITU-T definition: One way signaling at a time[edit (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Simplex_communication&action=edit&section=3)]According to the ITU-T (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITU_Telecommunication_Standardization_Sector) definition, a simplex circuit (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simplex_circuit) is one where signals can flow in only one direction at a time. At other times communications can flow in the reverse direction. A more common term for this application is half-duplex (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half-duplex). Examples are intercoms (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intercom), and two way radios (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_way_radio) such as walkie-talkies (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walkie-talkie), citizens band (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_band), and mobile radios used dispatch police (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Police), firefighters (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firefighter), and taxicabs (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxicab).
The old Western Union (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Union) company used the term simplex when describing the half-duplex (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duplex_(telecommunications)) and simplex capacity of their new transatlantic telegraph cable (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transatlantic_telegraph_cable) completed between Newfoundland (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newfoundland_(island)) and theAzores (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azores) in 1928.[1] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simplex_communication#cite_note-1) The same definition for a simplex radio channel was used by the National Fire Protection Association (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Fire_Protection_Association) in 2002.[2] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simplex_communication#cite_note-2)

Next, we'll discuss Nietzsche's narcissism of small differences. :neener:

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSsgvU4b7DPyE369qXDIquwBEgTIqS4L hCjvv03K7ccyjtW1_UFkQ



.

[K7SGJ]

Not exactly. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simplex_communication



Next, we'll discuss Nietzsche's narcissism of small differences. :neener:

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSsgvU4b7DPyE369qXDIquwBEgTIqS4L hCjvv03K7ccyjtW1_UFkQ



.


Followed closely by Eddie's 3rd corollary (or coronary) of IDGAF.

[WØTKX]

Oh, you care. You show it by your post(s). ;)

[W4GPL]

I over simplified to avoid exactly this.. :lol:

The fact is, in most ham applications, when the radio operator is transmitting, the person on the other end of the phone can't yell "shut up, you already told me about your inflamed hemorrhoids.." and expect the radio operator to hear it.

[K7SGJ]

:chin:
Oh, you care. You show it by your post(s). ;)


Speaking of posts, that reminds me, I have to go fix the gate where the connex delivery dude backed his semi into it last Thursday. True story. It is really twisted and FU.
Of course, that could also describe some of the inhabitants here, too. :chin:

[WØTKX]

I over simplified to avoid exactly this.. :lol:

The fact is, in most ham applications, when the radio operator is transmitting, the person on the other end of the phone can't yell "shut up, you already told me about your inflamed hemorrhoids.." and expect the radio operator to hear it.

Actually, that's an advantage at times. Like when doing tech support over the phone, and hitting the mute button so you can make comments that will not be heard on the other end. You KNOW you've done it, you SYSOP from hell, you! :stickpoke:

[W3WN]

Do people still use the auto patch phone feature in amateur radio?
< snip >I don't know offhand of any open repeaters in the Pittsburgh area that still have a working autopatch.

Simply put, the explosions of cell phones and smartphones has rendered most autopatches redundant and/or obsolete. So who wants to pay $$$ for a phone line to the repeater for something that is no longer being used?

[KC2UGV]

I don't know offhand of any open repeaters in the Pittsburgh area that still have a working autopatch.

Simply put, the explosions of cell phones and smartphones has rendered most autopatches redundant and/or obsolete. So who wants to pay $$$ for a phone line to the repeater for something that is no longer being used?

Interestingly enough, you should be able to just use the (hopefully) preexisting internet connection to set up a patch. And, it should be completely doable in software, with only a simple PTT switch.

[n2ize]

Do people still use the auto patch phone feature in amateur radio?

I remember when I first got my license and got into my first fender bender, the police officer allowed me to use his radio to call my mother. I had no idea what it was, or how it was done, but now that I'm reading up on it I realized that's what I was doing.

What circumstances would you use phone, aside from not having your cell phone, or having the cell towers jammed in emergencies/disasters? Those two are obvious.

Unlike many hams today I was on HF long before I ever got into VHF/UHF. A few of the local clubs round here had autopatch feature. Back in the late 80's/early 90's when I first got on VHF/UHF I used to hear it used now and then. Usually it was only available to dues paying club members and, not belonging to any local clubs, I never used nor needed to use the feature. If you had an emergency and needed to reach a family member but did not belong to a club and there was no pay-phone around sometimes a club member would fire up the autopatch and let you use it. These days I never hear anyone using autopatch these days. Cell phones made it obsolete. It's even hard to find a working pay-phone these days. Cell phones obsoleted them as well. Overall vhf repeater use is down, even during the rush-hour drive time. However I have recently had some nice chats via VHF repeaters over the last couple weeks.

BTW During and in the aftermath of Hurricane Sandy VHF repeaters were one of the most reliable ways to communicate. Cell phone service was spotty, sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn't. And I didn't have electricity or a generator to run any of my 1950's boatanchor HF rigs. But just about all of the local VHF and UHF repeaters were up and running, Fortunately I didn't have to pass any emergency traffic through them. But they were up and ready and reliable if need be. Prior to the hurricane's arrival I made sure my HT's battery pack was fully charged and ready.

[wa6mhz]

Autopatches have gone the way of 8 track tapes, VHS, pay phones and TV Repairmen.

A few still exist, but not many. Doubt the Sharp Autopatch gets 1 phone call a month!

[n2ize]

Autopatches have gone the way of 8 track tapes, VHS, pay phones and TV Repairmen.

A few still exist, but not many. Doubt the Sharp Autopatch gets 1 phone call a month!

I can still see it having a place in emergency situations. But otherwise why would anyone bother to use autopatch these days to make a general everyday call when you can just grab a cell phone and call direct.

[kb2vxa]

Call direct? I didn't know to use an AUTOpatch you had to go through an operator. (;->) Back in my CB daze I ran a phone patch, nothing against it in the rules incidentally. When I was licensed in '95 there were a few autopatches still around and I used one once to report an auto incident on the highway. 911 was a bit tricky, that's where Greenbrook (NJ) relayed to Union but the call went through. What highway you may ask? Just look at the quote before my sig line. (;->)

[W3WN]

Interestingly enough, you should be able to just use the (hopefully) preexisting internet connection to set up a patch. And, it should be completely doable in software, with only a simple PTT switch.Heh heh heh. Nice try, but presumes facts not in evidence.

How many repeaters have an internet connection? Remember that costs money too.

Many older repeater systems, simply put, don't. They use other methods for control purposes (at least, one would hope they do!).

[kb2vxa]

How many repeaters have Echolink or IRLP or are linked via the internet? Other methods for control? Remote bases are operated (voice & control) via the internet but repeaters most often use dial up DTMF control so the bottom line is repeaters are inexorably married to the telephone network. No, the internet isn't fiber, it's tubes. (;->)

[NQ6U]

How many repeaters have Echolink or IRLP or are linked via the internet? Other methods for control? Remote bases are operated (voice & control) via the internet but repeaters most often use dial up DTMF control so the bottom line is repeaters are inexorably married to the telephone network. No, the internet isn't fiber, it's tubes. (;->)

That may be the case in your part of the world but out here repeaters are typically placed on fairly remote mountaintop sites where even the mains power is often flaky. While telephone lines are available in some locations, it costs a small fortune to have one brought into the repeater shed so it's generally skipped in favor of a radio control link. Sometimes it's on the repeater input frequency, other times there's a dedicated UHF/microwave link.

[K9CCH]

If "phone" is an autopatch... what are they referring to here?


G2A08 (B)
Which of the following is a recommended way to break into a conversation when
using phone?
A. Say "QRZ" several times followed by your call sign
B. Say your call sign during a break between transmissions from the other
stations
C. Say "Break. Break. Break." and wait for a response
D. Say "CQ" followed by the call sign of either station

[NQ6U]

The correct way to break into a QSO in progress is to tune up your amp to 2500 watts, turn the mic gain up until everything distorts and you send harmonics up the entire band and then yell your call sign into the mic.

Seriously, just wait until there's a lull in the conversation then transmit your call sign. Also, in ham radio, the term "phone" is generally used for any sort of contact that's made via voice into a microphone, as opposed to CW (Morse Code), digital, RTTY etc.

[kb2vxa]

Now if you REALLY want to do it right just misadjust the neutralizing cap until it squeals like a stuck pig and flip the switch to CW (Class C) while transmitting SSB; super slop bucket. That way you're guaranteed to break in on every QSO on the band and then some without even adjusting the VFO to any particular frequency. I once heard a CBer splattering six ways to Sunday and never did figure out what channel he was on, CB, freeband, subspace???

Right about "phone", after all the Pope is infallible so always listen to him. Just to add something those outside the 75M AM window may not know, telephonium refers to yellowy audio from a rig that needs to be de-yellowfied. That is to say a stock transmitter, one incapable of singing Angel Music or in other words not Timtronized. HUH? Waddeesay?

"The two most important days of your life are the day you were born and the day you found out why."
I have only one important day then, I never did figure out why.

[K9CCH]

. Also, in ham radio, the term "phone" is generally used for any sort of contact that's made via voice into a microphone, as opposed to CW (Morse Code), digital, RTTY etc.


Ok this is what was confusing me....

[NQ6U]

Ok this is what was confusing me....

It's short for "radiotelephone."

[W7XF]

This WAS the procedure for the OPRC phone patch when it existed:

1. Wait till you ascertain that the frequency is clear.
2. Say your callsign, followed by "bringing up autopatch", then WITHOUT UNKEYING, dial * then phone number.
3. Unkey and wait for call to be placed. When called party answers, let them know you're using the autopatch.
4. MAXIMUM 3 MINUTES.
5. When call is completed, say your callsign, followed by "bringing down autopatch", dial #. Listen for dual tone courtesy beep, which will tell you the patch is
successfully hung up.
6. IN EMERGENCIES, SIMPLY KEY UP AND DIAL 911. Controller will disable timer for duration of 911 call. When call is complete, follow instructions on line 5.

ALL FCC regulations must be followed as to no business calls, except for assistance (e.g., calling for towing service for a breakdown).

[K7SGJ]

This WAS the procedure for the OPRC phone patch when it existed:

1. Wait till you ascertain that the frequency is clear.
2. Say your callsign, followed by "bringing up autopatch", then WITHOUT UNKEYING, dial * then phone number.
3. Unkey and wait for call to be placed. When called party answers, let them know you're using the autopatch.
4. MAXIMUM 3 MINUTES.
5. When call is completed, say your callsign, followed by "bringing down autopatch", dial #. Listen for dual tone courtesy beep, which will tell you the patch is
successfully hung up.
6. IN EMERGENCIES, SIMPLY KEY UP AND DIAL 911. Controller will disable timer for duration of 911 call. When call is complete, follow instructions on line 5.

ALL FCC regulations must be followed as to no business calls, except for assistance (e.g., calling for towing service for a breakdown).

Or a pizza if you are dying, of hunger?

[W3WN]

Or a pizza if you are dying, of hunger?:mrgreen:

When I moved to Pittsburgh, I worked in a (now defunct) ham store. We always had a "demo" radio on, usually scanning the 2 meter repeaters.

One day, one yahoo is talking with his buddies about problems with the new Cushcraft 2 M yagi he'd bought. (And it was very clear from the conversation that he hadn't bothered to RTFM, and was told as such, but noooooooo... he knew what he was doing.) So he decided to call the store and ask me some questions. On the repeater autopatch.

Since I knew what was going on, and was very nervous about my newly minted Extra (can you say, "the ink wasn't dry yet"? I knew you could), I simply said "Hello" when the phone rang. Long story short, I told him point blank that this was a business call, as far as I was concerned, and I'd be happy to talk with him in person or on the landline -- but NOT on the autopatch.

"How the hell do you know I'm on the autopatch?" he snarled
"Because I have the TR-7950 on the demo bench monitoring the (frequency) repeater." Repeated that he should call me on the landline, said goodbye, hung up.

I got called a few choice words on the repeater after that. He got told by the control op to knock it off. He never did call, or come in... sold the antenna for half of what he paid for it, new owner assembled it correctly & got a good antenna cheap. Can't recall now if the guy ever walked in the store again or not...

Too bad. You call a store you bought something on with a problem assembling it... how is that NOT a business related call?

[kb2vxa]

Ya just GOTTA love Pissburgh! Oh whaddya mean dial * and #? I don't see a * or a # on the dial and I don't see a dial on the microphone... WTF?