A4 Class Locomotive Gathering

[HUGH]

All the remaining British-built A4 class locomotives meeting at York Railway Museum.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF-UC967nJ4

[URL="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-york-north-yorkshire-23158389"]/URL]

[URL="http://www.heritagerailway.co.uk/news/six-a4s-to-be-reunited-for-mallard-75th-anniversary"/URL]


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xlut385l7k

[kb2vxa]

Ah yes, an A4 Pacific named for their designer, Sir Nigel Gresley, Chief Mechanical Engineer for the London & North Eastern Railway (LNER). The jewel in his crown is the blue one, Mallard, the fastest steam locomotive in the world at 126mph. Perhaps the most famous of them all was the flagship locomotive of the LNER, the A1 Class Flying Scotsman that is unique in two ways, it is also the name of the train. (The locomotive is separate from the train believe it or not.) Unlike in the video where the Sir Nigel Gresley is pulling the Coronation Scot and has that name on the smoke box with Gresley on the side of the boiler The Flying Scotsman had three name plaques and while hauling long distance trains in the Eastern and Northeastern regions it is noted for the 10:00am "up" London to Edinburgh run. The name lives on in the same tradition only this one is modern coaches pulled by a Diesel. So why was LNER so fascinated with Scots? Sir Nigel was born in Edinburgh.

Here are a few things you don't see in the videos, for that matter you'd have to look pretty hard to find them at all. 4472 went around the world, literally, but the Flying Scotsman didn't fly, it went by freighter. I tossed a coin to see whether Canada or Australia, it landed in Niagara Falls, Ontario back in 1971. I mentioned the new Flying Scotsman, somehow the soul went out of railroading when they pegged the Diesel with that name. <sniff> You saw Mallard, now here's a cab shot and look at all that copper! Hopefully somebody doesn't break into the National Railway Museum at York with a hacksaw. Lastly a rare but nostalgic photo, Sir Nigel standing next to his namesake.

[N2NH]

World record holder at 112 MPH? Very impressive. They use compound locomotives in the UK I believe?

I don't think that there are any remaining NYC J3a Hudsons (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NYC_Hudson) or NYC S-1b Niagaras (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NYC_Niagara) (Northern 4-8-4) left running here. I'm pretty sure that the Niagaras (pic below) were all scrapped after a mere 8 or so years of service where they were literally run into the ground. They did a lifetime of service in those 8 years.

Great vids. Thanks for posting them Hugh.

9882

Someday I hope to take the Flying Scotsman to London if it's still running. Probably not steam powered though.

9883

[kb2vxa]

I don't think there are any Hudsons or Niagaras running but there MAY be a CPR Royal Hudson made by Montreal Locomotive Works (Canadian Alco) still in excursion service. Like I said the Flying Scotsman is running but the original is on static display at York, I don't think there's anything special about a modern train unless it's the newest TGV on a test run. No, they don't run at 380mph in revenue service. (;->) Still there's a thrill riding a train going in excess of 100mph, like the Acela its predecessor the PRR Metroliner flew along at 110-120mph between New Brunswick and Princeton Jct. I was on one of the first revenue runs and it was an eerie feeling watching the cat poles fly by like slats on a picket fence with no sensation of motion and no clickety clack, just the quiet ssshhh of welded rail. Then it happened... bang, bang... BAM and the scream of dynamic brakes as the train went into emergency stop. There we were in the middle of nowhere with the crew doing the mandatory walk around but soon we were back underway nothing having been damaged. The conductor told me a rock hit the D bar, that's the dragging equipment detector that automatically stops the train. I'm not sure just how but they fixed the problem but they don't suck up ballast anymore.

BTW No800 was the prototype, the first in the series. That's like GG-1 No4800 "Old Rivets" was the prototype of that series. Being the design was changed to a welded body it's one of a kind and on static display at the B&O Railroad Museum at Baltimore, MD.

[N2NH]

I don't think there are any Hudsons or Niagaras running but there MAY be a CPR Royal Hudson made by Montreal Locomotive Works (Canadian Alco) still in excursion service. Like I said the Flying Scotsman is running but the original is on static display at York, I don't think there's anything special about a modern train unless it's the newest TGV on a test run. No, they don't run at 380mph in revenue service. (;->) Still there's a thrill riding a train going in excess of 100mph, like the Acela its predecessor the PRR Metroliner flew along at 110-120mph between New Brunswick and Princeton Jct. I was on one of the first revenue runs and it was an eerie feeling watching the cat poles fly by like slats on a picket fence with no sensation of motion and no clickety clack, just the quiet ssshhh of welded rail. Then it happened... bang, bang... BAM and the scream of dynamic brakes as the train went into emergency stop. There we were in the middle of nowhere with the crew doing the mandatory walk around but soon we were back underway nothing having been damaged. The conductor told me a rock hit the D bar, that's the dragging equipment detector that automatically stops the train. I'm not sure just how but they fixed the problem but they don't suck up ballast anymore.

BTW No800 was the prototype, the first in the series. That's like GG-1 No4800 "Old Rivets" was the prototype of that series. Being the design was changed to a welded body it's one of a kind and on static display at the B&O Railroad Museum at Baltimore, MD.

I checked. The Niagaras were all scrapped and the same with the NYC Hudsons. As the Niagaras were taken out of service due to firebox problems, they were retired. They were run 6 days a week. They were cleaned while the boiler was still hot and the crew used asbestos suits to do the job in +200o heat. Too bad, they were beautiful machines.

Impressive. I remember the original PRR Metroliners which were the template for all of AMTRAKs first cars. I don't remember if I ever saw "Old Rivets" but I have seen the pictures. It sort of looked patched up with all the rivets on it. Interestingly, I was on a PRR (or was it PC - 1969) train pulled by a GG-1 that was over an hour late due to an undisclosed problem. This was in Wilmington DE. I used the mile markers to time it with my watch and came up with 128 MPH. The conductor saw my face and had a very quiet conversation with me. When I told him my calculations, he said his were 131MPH. I was surprised to be so close (I was 15). Found out later that was the record until the Metroliner replaced it a few years later. Those things could haul *ss.

BTW, we got into Pennsylvania Station, New York 15 minutes early. Must've been a Friday. ;)

http://i.imgur.com/TZgLj.jpg

[N8YX]

All I see around these parts are SDx0MACs, the occasional Geep road engine and our local belt line's pair of SW1500s. :(

[kb2vxa]

Heh, all I see around here are a couple of MLW MP20B-3s (rebuilt EMD GP40-PH2s) or the Geeps since they look alike unless you see the model number on the frame below the windows and Alstom PL42ACs. Back home along the PRR main not much of a selection either, GG-1s, E44s, E33s that looked identical and the ubiquitous MP54 MUs. The good part was mixed passenger and freight, by day they came about every 20 minutes, by night freight dominated when passenger service was suspended from 2:00 to 5:00am and than every 40 minutes.

"I remember the original PRR Metroliners which were the template for all of AMTRAKs first cars."
They WERE Amtrak's first cars, all they did was paint over the PRR keystone with Amtrak and put a red white and blue stripe down the side. They scrounged rolling stock from the original railroads it took over (mostly PRR/PC) and kept the numbering. It took several years for them to buy their own Amfleet coaches and locomotives. BTW NJT was originally NJDoT that did the same thing, they still have a couple of repainted CNJ GP40 Red Barons kicking around after several rebuilds.

Penn-Central operated from 1968 to 1976 so you rode behind an ex PRR black GG-1 with the stripes and keystone painted over (or the entire Tuscan Red body) and replaced by the PC logo.
"I used the mile markers to time it with my watch and came up with 128 MPH. The conductor saw my face and had a very quiet conversation with me. When I told him my calculations, he said his were 131MPH."
You were both wrong, not because you didn't use a stop watch but because you don't know the specs of the locomotive, its history or PC operating rules. For passenger service they were geared for 100mph and for freight it was 90mph, in the test which pitted one against the PRR workhorse, a K4 it reached a speed of 110mph and arrived in Washington from New York first, won by a nose. The speed limit was and is 69mph except for the Budd Metroliner 120 and now Bombardier/Alstom Acela 150 on a few short stretches between Boston and Washington. If the G was going faster than 69 the engineer was laying it on the line, I doubt it when there is no penalty for late arrival.

"Found out later that was the record until the Metroliner replaced it a few years later."
Eh, the OFFICIAL record was as I said 110 held by the GG-1 so you were off only by 18mph in your dream. Eh, are you SURE it wasn't a Budd Metroliner doing its thing? They were PC, delivered in 1969 wearing PRR livery, I don't think PC ever changed it and they went directly into Amtrak colors. BTW I hated those interim railroads, I don't know which was worse, Pretty Crappy or Conjob.

Conrail quality? Yeah, we know... (;->)

[NQ6U]

I woke up late one night aboard the Coast Starlight, somewhere north of Sacramento. It was obvious by the sound and motion of the coach that the train was moving along at quite a clip. The train was pretty standard Amtrak equipment of the mid-Eighties—an F40PH locomotive and Superliner coaches. When I asked the conductor about it the next morning, he smiled, reminded me of Amtrak's 79 MPH speed limit but allowed that they might have exceeded that by "a bit."

[N2NH]

I never did ride the classic Metroliner. I did ride the successor which looked like any other Amtrak NE Corridor train, but on a faster schedule. It would get you to DC an hour to an hour and a half quicker than the regular train.

Maybe it wasn't official, but it was what the conductor said. Being on the last car was like being on a rollercoaster going off the rails. There was one GG-1 that broke the rules. It was set-up for a trial run to see how the Metroliner would do and used a 8 car trainset. That supposedly ran over 150.


by PRRTechFan (http://www.railroad.net/forums/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=3071&sid=18c9f4852d74adc0e359e058f9cfbbcd) » Mon May 09, 2005 3:13 pmIt is my recollection that in 1968 or 1969, PRR had a "test train" in anticipation of Metroliner service. This train was a specially re-geared GG-1 along with 8 specially-sprung Pullman coaches, along with some state-of-the-art instrumentation for the time. Track 3 through Princeton Junction had been rebuilt with heavier rail and heavier copper on the catenary; and I believe that section of catenary was converted to constant tension. Also, I believe the taps were changed on a set of transformers in the Nassau substation to allow them to tap up to a blazing 13kV for tests.


This train, powered by a single GG-1; set a speed record of I believe 156mph that stood for an awfully long time. Somewhere, I have a newspaper clipping showing the train flying through PJ on the day the record was made; I'll have to try and find it.

From another forum. (http://www.railroad.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=13554)(Scroll down)

Also from the same thread on said forum:


by Jersey_Mike (http://www.railroad.net/forums/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=955&sid=18c9f4852d74adc0e359e058f9cfbbcd) » Mon May 09, 2005 2:55 pm
The G's were officially geared for 100, but from what I have read it was fairly easy to peg the speedometer on them and run faster.

Now, the Silver Star is still a first class train. Northbound it doesn't really pick up speed until it reaches Union Station in Washington. Then it may not be an Acela, but you know you're flying. We were constantly being held at the station for being too early all the way up.

[kb2vxa]

"Being on the last car was like being on a rollercoaster going off the rails."

Eh, going off the rails backward can't compare to doing it forward in the engineer's cabin of an MP54 EMU. Cab rides were SO easy since the door was almost always open and I just walked up and asked, none ever said no. Rickety old wrecks buzzed and clattered like they were falling apart until they got moving, THEN things got interesting on what we called Rock And Roll Railroad.
Turn it up LOUD!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcoweoZ6jpM

[N2NH]

"Being on the last car was like being on a rollercoaster going off the rails."

Eh, going off the rails backward can't compare to doing it forward in the engineer's cabin of an MP54 EMU. Cab rides were SO easy since the door was almost always open and I just walked up and asked, none ever said no. Rickety old wrecks buzzed and clattered like they were falling apart until they got moving, THEN things got interesting on what we called Rock And Roll Railroad.
Turn it up LOUD!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcoweoZ6jpM

Wish I'd known that as a kid. I would've really loved to ride in the cab.

I think I remember seeing some old MP-54s. They had a porthole window for the motorman to see if it's the cars I'm thinking about. No air conditioning either. Used to see them when on the Pennsy/PC/Amtrak passed them. They'd be on the local track. Were they NJDOT in the late 60s/early 70s?

Yep, I even had a brass set of these in "N" scale.

http://i44.tinypic.com/2uj4msj.jpg

[kb2vxa]

I don't remember NJDoT or NJT having any MP54 leftovers, probably like the title of Ralph Nader's book Unsafe At Any Speed. That's the PRR rock 'n roll rattletraps, Lehigh Valley had a 1500VDC version and early Metro North had a 600VDC third rail version, Static Island Rabid Transmit had a cross between an MP54 and an R Series BMT subway car right down to rattan seats and ceiling fans. I often rode the Rabids and got the next best thing to a cab ride every time, I stood behind the door just outside the engineer's position enclosed by a folding screen talking to my friend Johnny German. Yeah, some people you just can't forget.

BTW, the shuttle between St. George (the Staten Island Ferry Terminal) and Toonerville (Tottenville, the nick from the Toonerville Trolley http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toonerville_Folks) was the end of a day long excursion on the CNJ and ferry. Back then the CNJ had a ferry from Jersey City to Manhattan Pier 82 and it was just a short walk down West St. to the Battery and another quarter to cross to Staten Island. Yeah, a whole two bits! (;->) One time a friend and I overstayed on the island and missed the last train home so we rode the Staten Island Ferry all night killing time until morning. In the wee hours we were the only two aboard besides the captain and his mate, then it happened. The mate wandered over and we had a short conversation over by an unmarked door and he said "wait here" and went through the door. In a few he came back and invited us up the stairs, we found ourselves in the wheelhouse of the then new Verrazano, sister ship of the John F. Kennedy. All I can say is it was the best "cab ride" of my life, brand new computer aided navigation and controls, a few levers and buttons instead of the old wheel and engine room signal stand. The panoramic view from the windows and large radar display matched perfectly, even if it were pea soup fog I could see the skyline and everything in the harbor... WOW!

Then there were the pretend cab rides, playing engineer actually at 3:00am in the South Amboy engine yard. There were GG-1s and F units, one of the Gs had a clear signal so all I needed was the brake handle if I had the cajones to take it out. The Fs sat there idling all night so the rumble and vibration of the footplate gave them a live feel, cool. Good thing no bulls around BTW. The G had a tiny niche for the engineer and the fireman's side not much bigger, just no adornments, but the passage between them was a fair size and each side had a passage around the transformer to the other end where everything was duplicated. Oh, here's the un cropped version of the photo you posted, PRR MP54s @ Raritan River NJ 1966 taken from the South Amboy side.

[N2NH]

I don't remember NJDoT or NJT having any MP54 leftovers, probably like the title of Ralph Nader's book Unsafe At Any Speed. That's the PRR rock 'n roll rattletraps, Lehigh Valley had a 1500VDC version and early Metro North had a 600VDC third rail version, Static Island Rabid Transmit had a cross between an MP54 and an R Series BMT subway car right down to rattan seats and ceiling fans. I often rode the Rabids and got the next best thing to a cab ride every time, I stood behind the door just outside the engineer's position enclosed by a folding screen talking to my friend Johnny German. Yeah, some people you just can't forget.

BTW, the shuttle between St. George (the Staten Island Ferry Terminal) and Toonerville (Tottenville, the nick from the Toonerville Trolley http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toonerville_Folks) was the end of a day long excursion on the CNJ and ferry. Back then the CNJ had a ferry from Jersey City to Manhattan Pier 82 and it was just a short walk down West St. to the Battery and another quarter to cross to Staten Island. Yeah, a whole two bits! (;->) One time a friend and I overstayed on the island and missed the last train home so we rode the Staten Island Ferry all night killing time until morning. In the wee hours we were the only two aboard besides the captain and his mate, then it happened. The mate wandered over and we had a short conversation over by an unmarked door and he said "wait here" and went through the door. In a few he came back and invited us up the stairs, we found ourselves in the wheelhouse of the then new Verrazano, sister ship of the John F. Kennedy. All I can say is it was the best "cab ride" of my life, brand new computer aided navigation and controls, a few levers and buttons instead of the old wheel and engine room signal stand. The panoramic view from the windows and large radar display matched perfectly, even if it were pea soup fog I could see the skyline and everything in the harbor... WOW!

Then there were the pretend cab rides, playing engineer actually at 3:00am in the South Amboy engine yard. There were GG-1s and F units, one of the Gs had a clear signal so all I needed was the brake handle if I had the cajones to take it out. The Fs sat there idling all night so the rumble and vibration of the footplate gave them a live feel, cool. Good thing no bulls around BTW. The G had a tiny niche for the engineer and the fireman's side not much bigger, just no adornments, but the passage between them was a fair size and each side had a passage around the transformer to the other end where everything was duplicated. Oh, here's the un cropped version of the photo you posted, PRR MP54s @ Raritan River NJ 1966 taken from the South Amboy side.

I knew a full bulls from when I was in training. Not a good job to have at night in the bad side of town, in the middle of the city yet still isolated from the city.

That uncropped pic is beautiful. Typical for the area leading to NYC. Swamps, rivers, bridges and radio antenna towers.

Was in Tottenville a year ago before hiking north. Nice, suburban and isolated now. I don't think a lot of the neighborhood is like it was then. Sandy did a number on SI. You could see a train route along the NJ coast on the other side of Raritan Bay.

On MNCRR, they've finally retired the last of the FL-9s/F-10s. Now M-1, M-2 and M-3 MUs are being scrapped.

As far as the SIRT (Toonerville Trolley), this is what Wikipedia has on their AB Standard clones. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ME-1_(New_York_City_Subway_car))

[kb2vxa]

"...in the middle of the city yet still isolated from the city."
You lost me there, WHAT city? Generally Manhattan is considered "the city" by New Yawkas and Jerkyites in the know but the railroad yards are in the outer boroughs and may be considered the bad side of town. Day or night it's all dangerous only dark is kind of spooky.

"That uncropped pic is beautiful."
In and of itself it is beautiful (to a railfan at least) but having been part of my old stomping grounds I can say back then it was anything but. It didn't smell too good either thanks to heavy industry, BOnne with the emphasis on B O was the armpit of New Jersey, Perth Amboy was the asshole, in between was Cancer Alley. Thankfully National Lead & Titanium among others left the area so no more white dust storms at the Raritan Tolls on the Parkway and the bay has been cleaned up BUT headed north once you go over the bridge, any bridge you detect a strange smell, you ain't down the shore no more.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCWPxRpBVqY

"Swamps, rivers, bridges and radio antenna towers."
Not swamps but salt marshes, there is a difference. Along the NJT North Jersey Coast Line we have one at Morgan Creek and several rivers along the way, the last one going south to Bay Head is the Manasquan between Brielle and my present QTH Point Pleasant Beach. Then of course is the muddy Raritan, restoration of service south of Perth Amboy following Sandy was delayed due to repairs to the swing bridge in the picture, it got slammed by a large boat broken loose from its moorings. Headed north to New York between Newark Penn and Portal (the Hudson River tunnel entrance) there is the Meadowlands, a huge salt marsh and wildlife sanctuary with an antenna forest west of the Turnpike. Oak Island hasn't been an island for longer than I don't know but the rail yard is still there and in the 1800s the marsh extended south to Elizabeth, now it's Port Newark and Port Elizabeth with Newark Liberty International Airport at the southern end. BTW the airport is a couple of feet below sea level and surrounded by a moat, it's kept dry by constantly running pumps. Just for fun I'd like to see the mains power fail and the Diesels quit... glug glug gurgle gurgle. (;->)

"Was in Tottenville a year ago before hiking north. Nice, suburban and isolated now."
I don't know what gave you that idea.
"I don't think a lot of the neighborhood is like it was then."
It hasn't been the same since they built the ferry terminal, you can go across to Perth Amboy for the last decade or so. The whole southern portion of the island has been so built up you can't tell one side of the Kill Van Kull from the other.

"Sandy did a number on SI."
Tell me about it, overall New York got hit HARD. Interestingly enough the farther you got from the coast the less damage you saw but Static Island was nothing compared to the destruction on the barrier islands I'm on the north end of. Not TOO bad here in "the beach" but everything to the south was devastated, not far from me in Mantaloking the storm surge cut a new inlet since filled in and utility lines restored.

"You could see a train route along the NJ coast on the other side of Raritan Bay."
Yeah, the afore mentioned North Jersey Coast Line a block west of my QTH.

"On MNCRR, they've finally retired the last of the FL-9s/F-10s."
S'bout time, they're so ancient they're beyond a rebuild to meet EPA emission standards. A few years ago they started buying new locos that resemble EMD Geeps but darn, my memory stinks and I'm too tired (lame excuse) to search the archives.
"Now M-1, M-2 and M-3 MUs are being scrapped."
Again s'bout time, they've been operating M4s long enough.

I really don't have to visit a museum to remember the ME-1 SIRT cars, rat traps for sure but they had this SIRTain charm and smelled like... railroad (mostly ozone). What they have today just seems so... I don't know... new? They're like all NYCTA cars, all shiny stuff with an LED display above the ends and the DING DONG doors. I have a feeling Alstom had a hand in it, the new NJT coaches have those station announcement signs that talk at you and BING BONG doors that won't let the train move until they're all closed and the lights turn from yellow to green. Not so new or shiny but the few Bombardier coaches left give you peace and quiet.

Notes on the pictures:
When a new PL42AC breaks down it's an old F40PH-2CAT to the rescue. That picture was taken from a small park on the western end of Broadway, there's a diving school in town and they practice in the shallow backwater. Oh, the CAT means a Caterpillar prime mover. Hey, we're hiding a GG-1 in Clinton but I won't tell you exactly where. (;->)