What A Day

[KA9MOT]

My sons, Stevie & Jeffery, and I started early this morning. We set out to put up 80M Loop (Delta or normal). A few quick trips around the yard, measuring the distance between my supports (Trees) and it became obvious that 80M was out of the question, but if we were really good, we might be able to get a 40M Delta up.

Turns out, we're not really good. Got the ropes up and over the trees and there was just too much interference from the branches that form the trees canopy. So, we changed our plans again and went for 20M.

It fits! Sorta. I have a 20M Delta that looks funny as hell and just doesn't work. :(

9 hours, shot in the ass.

[K7SGJ]

Well, at least you got to spend some time with the kids.

[KA9MOT]

Well, at least you got to spend some time with the kids.

Ahhh... the silver lining in this cloud! Jeff enjoyed it. Stevie had much better things to do, and whined about it constantly. :lol:

[K7SGJ]

One outta two aint bad.

[KA9MOT]

This too is true!

Storming here right now. I have everything disconnected so no radio tonight.

I think that now that I have ropes in my trees, I might build go back to my roots and build a fan dipole for 20M and up (20, 15, 10 and 6M). That's where my OCF Dipole seems not to perform to my expectations. It is worthless on 15M and 6M.

[PA5COR]

Any OCF laid out for 80 and above will have a deminishing radiation pattern above 20 meters i know, i have one at 45 feet here above good ground.
For 17-10 i use a vertical and that is just fine, i still can use the OCF there for listening and see if it works better there as the vertical.
For 160-20 i (ab)use the inverted L with autotuner that on 80 gives lots more bang for the buck as the OCF certainly for DX to Japan etc, lower angle of radiation and all that, goes for 40 too, 20 is a toss up between the L and the OCF.

If you could put up the loop that would be a good antenna, quiet in listening as well.
Good to see you have some fun trying out, pity it didn't go as expected though, but don't give up.
For 160 i have been experimenting for years on my small plot, but with 3000 feet radials in the ground or just above and a 77 feet vertical ad 77 feet horizontal section it just works quite fine on 160 -20.

I lengthened the OCF on the short side with a 180 micro Henry coil and some meters wire so it is also resonant at 160 meters.
Just build a recieve loop 4 feet diameter with long tailed pair 2n4427 trandsistor amplifier for recieve on 20 KHz to 30 MHz, aiding in battling noise here.

Keep on trying ;)

[KG4CGC]

Feedline question: what are you feeding it with? A long run of window/ladder line could be your saving grace as a tuning stub.

[PA5COR]

Coax fed with 1:6 transformer and 1:1 current balun to stop radiation on the feedline. standard 1/3 to 2/3 feedpoint.

Standard Fritzel OCF for 1500 Watt balun AMA 83 .
You could feed it with ladderline but this one already was complete when i got it.
Works fine 160 -10 but as all other "allband" antenna's it is always a compromise antenna if you get it up high enough it is just as good as any other 1/2 wave dipole.
Higher bands where the atenna becomes multi wavelength long will see the deeper nulls and peaks come up.
Radiation will depend on high off the ground for lower angle of radiation, 45 feet is good enogh for 20 and up.
That's why the inverted L works better on the lower bands lower angle of radiation and at 77 feet high for good dx.
On 80 from the Netherlands to Japan the L is 3 S points better as the OCF.
The old IMAX 2000 with 5 meter long radial wires on the roof will outperform the OCF on 17 to 10 as well though the OCF is not suited for some WARC bands.
It will recieve there though, so i can switch on th fly to several antenna's to see which one gives the best reception.
On QRZ you see th last piccie where all antena's can be seen on and next to my house, small plot it is...
The OCF is between 3 rows of housing the middle one is mine where the feedline comes down.
From the top of the L a wire runs down of 77 feet to amast in a tree at 45 feet above ground.
3000 feet copper in and on the ground as radials fed by a MFJ 998 autotuner legal limit 1500 watt direct fed at the feedpoint of the L.
The Heathkit SB-1000 can deliver 1000 watts but is mostly limited to 700-800 watts max here with the new 3-500 ZG.
But 95% of all qso's are made with 100- 200 wats from the FT 2000-D.
http://www.pa0fri.com/ go to ant then FD-4 for some design tips. use the English version top section.

[kb2vxa]

As always I have quotes and lyrics for everything and two fit the misadventure rather well.

The Professor concluded with: Is that what's troubling you bunkie? Well hold your head up high, take a walk in the SUN and never give up, never give up, never give up that ship!

Meatloaf had a few words for "Little Stevie Whiny" (sorry Stevie Wonder): Now don't be sad, 'cause two out of three ain't bad. Eh, SGJ forgot there were three of you. (;->)

Anyway don't forget there are two ways to solve a problem. If at first you don't succeed use a bigger hammer. If all else fails dynamite always works. When it comes to wire antennas the bigger hammer becomes a spool of copper wire, a lineman's splice and solder, waste not want not because copper is expensive. When it comes to adequate supports for the antenna you really want dynamite the trees and put up support masts. So do you want shade or a good antenna? Decisions, decisions, decisions.

>POP!< That was the sound of tongue being removed from cheek.

[W2NAP]

you can always go this route http://degood.org/coaxtrap/ 80-10 trap dipole. 60ft overall.

[KA9MOT]

Feedline question: what are you feeding it with? A long run of window/ladder line could be your saving grace as a tuning stub.

RG-213 MIL into 4:1 homebrew balun. It is a support issue. Right now the thing looks like a wooden wedge a carpenter would place to level a window. A long and narrow triangle. My yard is 180 Feet long and 40 feet wide, but I rent and I have to use what I have and can not attach anything to the house.

I got rid of my vertical because I couldn't keep the radials on the ground. Staple them down and the landlord would find a way to pull them up while mowing and he was always complaining about them. No towers allowed either.

[KA9MOT]

you can always go this route http://degood.org/coaxtrap/ 80-10 trap dipole. 60ft overall.

This is interesting.... I'll have give it some thought.

[W2NAP]

This is interesting.... I'll have give it some thought.

Thats what ill build up I think. course its not like full 1/2 wave dipoles or beams. but it get ya on air. (I had a ft-847 tossed to me) think ill build the 80-10 and build a 12-17-6 and put it inside the room here.

also gonna have to build me a 144 and 432 horizontal loop for 2/430 cw/ssb

[W3WN]

RG-213 MIL into 4:1 homebrew balun. It is a support issue. Right now the thing looks like a wooden wedge a carpenter would place to level a window. A long and narrow triangle. My yard is 180 Feet long and 40 feet wide, but I rent and I have to use what I have and can not attach anything to the house.

I got rid of my vertical because I couldn't keep the radials on the ground. Staple them down and the landlord would find a way to pull them up while mowing and he was always complaining about them. No towers allowed either.Now, that's odd. I have several radials stapled down in my back yard, and they have never come up while mowing.

I learned THAT one the hard way a long, long time ago, when I lost the 80 meter radial to my (then) roof-mounted HF6V; I hadn't had it properly stapled to the ground, the mower got it, and I had a fun hour removing copper wire from around the mower blade axis.

I suspect that your landlord is afraid that that might happen, and is manually removing the radial(s).

One thing that can be done... find a flat-bladed shovel, cut a small slit in the grass (just enough to get under the thatch & roots), slip the radial(s) in under the grass. Within a week or so, the slit is completely gone. Of course, it's easier for me to do this, since I'm not renting, just paying blood money a mortgage to the bank.

[KA9MOT]

Now, that's odd. I have several radials stapled down in my back yard, and they have never come up while mowing.

I suspect that your landlord is afraid that that might happen, and is manually removing the radial(s).

I'm certain that is what is going on. But, it is his property so I have to respect his "hints".


One thing that can be done... find a flat-bladed shovel, cut a small slit in the grass (just enough to get under the thatch & roots), slip the radial(s) in under the grass. Within a week or so, the slit is completely gone. Of course, it's easier for me to do this, since I'm not renting, just paying blood money a mortgage to the bank.

I'm physically unable to lay out radials, so I must rely on helpers. I get crazy looks when I ask my helpers to staple the radials/coax to the ground. I'd probably get shot if I were to hand out shovels! :lol:

Funny thing though.... my coax never gets pulled up.