RC Helicopters

[N8YX]

(I think John, 'ize started one with the same theme but my search-fu is weak this morning. If anyone finds it I'll merge them.)

Does anyone find these contraptions addictive? I don't have space to fly a big gas-powered model but the Helo TC, Parrot AR-Drone and similar IR/WiFi-controlled setups look to be a hoot.

That is, if I can keep from crashing my 'TC. :wall:

I can fly the various sims very well but for some reason the control software which the Helo uses seems to be unresponsive at times. This leads to over-correction and crashes.

My latest cat either hates the thing or is totally fascinated with taking it out of the air - he's hard to read.

[N2CHX]

I have one with 16" blade span that can only be flown outdoors. I haven't touched it in quite a while. I had another that was tiny and I used it to perform air raids on the cats. THAT thing was COOL! But then I was teasing my daughter's stupid dog with it when it was here for the entire month before it went back to where it came from (Don't even get me started on that!) and it lunged and chewed it into a dozen pieces. Haven't flown one since, but they are a LOT of fun with cats.

[N8YX]

There's a version with a squirt gun. Reckon I should have opted for that one? :whistle:

[N2CHX]

There's a version with a squirt gun. Reckon I should have opted for that one? :whistle:

Hahahahaha! I haven't seen that. I want to mount a laser on one. My cats would go batshit over that.

[N2CHX]

BTW, for anyone who doesn't know.... The key to learning how to fly the bigger ones, like my big one that actually has a single set of blades and collective pitch, is to keep it on the ground for a LONG time before you gently persuade it into the air. I spent hours with mine on the ground, learning how to gently push it around with the controls, and then took it up a few inches at a time, so if I lost control it wouldn't have far to fall. You don't crank on the controls, you nudge them.

Three years later, my 'copter will still work if I pull it off the shelf. My husband on the other hand, took his out and cranked it. Took it straight up first thing, way up in the air, thinking it was as easy to fly as it looked. He broke his in the first flight. Five minutes and it was done.

[KK4AMI]

I think miniaturization and the "electric motor/battery pack" made everything RC more addictive. Bought my nephew (two, too,to :) ) Canadian micro miniature wifi RC sets with foam aircraft (5 inch wing span). We sat in the living room doing air to air combat. You are right about the dog issue. My nephew's yellow lab snapped one out of the air like Godzilla. The little electric helos look pretty popular at the stores this year.

http://www.microflight.com/

[n2ize]

These days there are so many different types of RC helicopters that it is hard to describe them all. First there are the "toy grade" ones. These are usually three channel jobs. They fly okay, can only be used indoors, and have limited control. Then there are the "hobby grade" ones. These are usually at least 4 channels and have full throttle control, full cyclic control, and full rudder control (via tail rotor). Some even have full collective control (i,.e. ability to change the pitch of the blades). But, even with all these features there are many sub categories to chose from. You have the coaxial type which has two main rotor blades one above the other that spin in opposite directions. Most of these are small and are for indoor flying our outdoors on very calm days. One advantage of the coaxial type is there incredible stability, they are great for beginners. Disadvantages are poor wind performance, they can't make banked turns, they cannot do fast forward flight, etc. Next step up are the single rotor types. These vary in size from very small to very large and are powered by electric, gas, and even real jet engines... depending on size of course. They vary in size from small enough to fit in the palm of the hand, to the 200 size, 400 size, and the very big 600's and larger.
BTW the most popular RC helicopters these days are electrics... even when you get into the expensive large ones. Many electrics nowadays will outperform gas helicopters. Plus they tend to sound more realistic and are particularly nice if you do scale flying. Oh, and then there are even two main sub categories among the single rotor helicopters. Some are fixed pitch (you control your lift by changing the speed of the rotor via the throttle) and others are collective pitch (you vary the lift by changing the blade pitch). Advantages of the fixed pitch type are,,, less expensive and simpler rotor head design, less breakage in crashes, easier to repair, less complicated to operate, etc. Disadvantages of the fixed pitch are poor wind performance. The spinning rotor acts like a wing and if you get hit with a sudden gust of wind you get a dramatic increase in lift and the helicopter goes sailing way way way up and out of site. The only way to retrieve is to cut the throttle allowing the copter to fall and hope you can recover it before hitting the ground. Collective pitch is much better in wind because unwanted lift can be compensated by giving the rotor negative pitch thus negating the lift.

Which helicopter you buy depends on many factors. How much you are willing to spend, how much experience you have, etc. If you are a beginner and never flown before you might want to get a hobby grade coaxial type. They are fun, nice and stable and easy to fly, and will give you a feel for the controls. If you want to go with something more challenging then go with a single rotor. What size you get depends on where you plan to fly. If you plan to learn indoors get one of the many very small, indoor,self stabilizing fixed or collective pitch types. If you have a small-medium sized property then perhaps go with a small-medium sized fixed pitch (200 - 300) size category such as the Honeybee. These are a good starting point even for someone with a lot of room to fly. Once you feel comfortable flying that the next step might be a 400 size single rotor collective pitch helicopter, such as a TRex 400 or a Trex clone. Collective pitch is a must have if you fly often and in wind.

[n2ize]

BTW, here is a link to a comprehensive guide to the different types of RC helicopters, from toy grade copters to jet helicopters. This is about the best guide that I have found online to date. It covers all the different types, their advantages and disadvantages, etc... I highly recommend this to anyone thinking of buying one...

http://www.rchelicopterfun.com/

[X-Rated]

When I worked at CTS, we had a guy bring in his helicopter for show and tell. The thing was amazing. He could fly it upside down, even. He refused to ever drink any alcohol or anything with caffeine in it because he said it would affect his ability to control his helicopter flying abilities. He took it seriously.

[n2ize]

I have one with 16" blade span that can only be flown outdoors.

That is about the size of my Honeybee CP... which is still relatively small. I got mine during Christmas a few years ago and I learned to hover it in my living room. I have a Trex 400 kit but I haven;t even started building it yet.


BTW, for anyone who doesn't know.... The key to learning how to fly the bigger ones, like my big one that actually has a single set of blades and collective pitch, is to keep it on the ground for a LONG time before you gently persuade it into the air. I spent hours with mine on the ground, learning how to gently push it around with the controls, and then took it up a few inches at a time, so if I lost control it wouldn't have far to fall. You don't crank on the controls, you nudge them.

You still have to be careful. I personally know a beginner who built a TRex 400 clone , tested it and everything looked fine, and then took it outside. The second he nudged it even slightly off the ground it tilted, snapped and rolled. He destroyed the rotor head in about a second... a costly repair. You may have noticed that as the heli leaves the ground it wants to tilt, this is normal... But you have to be ready to apply a little bit of cyclic in the opposite direction. Otherwise if there is not enough clearance a blade may strike the ground and it will roll over and lop off the rotor head.

Another thing to be wary of when flying or maneuvering close to the ground is... ground turbulence. The wash from the rotor head striking the ground and nearby objects makes the heli unstable. Notice how difficult it is to hover in one place when you are only a few inches off the ground. But as soon as you get 4 or 5 feet off the ground the heli suddenly hovers with much greater stability and you can keep it in one spot indefinitely.



Three years later, my 'copter will still work if I pull it off the shelf. My husband on the other hand, took his out and cranked it. Took it straight up first thing, way up in the air, thinking it was as easy to fly as it looked. He broke his in the first flight. Five minutes and it was done.

Well, he didn't do too bad if he was able to keep it in the air for five minutes. I've seen a lot of beginners last no more than 5 seconds. Often they show up to the field with a beautiful ready made kit, fire it up, take off, and 5 seconds later it's laying all cracked up in the middle of the field. I saw one rank beginner take off and a second later it went into a chain link fence because he didn't know how to properly use the cyclic. Some give up at that point and never return. Others ask what they should do next. I usually recommend they get a simulator and practice...

[n2ize]

When I worked at CTS, we had a guy bring in his helicopter for show and tell. The thing was amazing. He could fly it upside down, even. He refused to ever drink any alcohol or anything with caffeine in it because he said it would affect his ability to control his helicopter flying abilities. He took it seriously.

And it should be taken very seriously If it's a large helicopter, like a 400 size or larger it can be dangerous. Poor judgement and colliding it with a person can inflict serious injury or death. RC aircraft over a certain size are not toys and must be handled with extreme care. Safety is paramount.

[K7SGJ]

I've been flying those things for awhile, and I never get tired of it. The indoor ones can be fun, but when the HVAC kicks on and you happen to be near a vent, it can get interesting. As far as outdoor goes, there is a small window of time during the day when the air is calm enough to fly. I have one that has a camera in it, and uses a micro SD card for storage. I used it last summer to fly along the roof to help me locate storm damaged tile. It sure beat climbing up and down a ladder.

[KC9ECI]

Got two helicopters, one that was supposed to work with my ipod touch as a controller, ferschnickered right out of the box. 2nd one, little thing that I can fly around the house, IR controller. Take it to work some days and fly it around the shop when I'm on break.

I happen to know that there is a Lanyu F4U RTF wrapped up and waiting for me under the Christmas tree. Got a 6ch simulator and Clearview that I've been practicing with. Won't even bother to take the plane out of the box until the snow melts and the grass is green. Also have a V911 helicopter on the way and a Lanyu mini Cessna en route.

[K7SGJ]

Got two helicopters, one that was supposed to work with my ipod touch as a controller, ferschnickered right out of the box. 2nd one, little thing that I can fly around the house, IR controller. Take it to work some days and fly it around the shop when I'm on break.

I happen to know that there is a Lanyu F4U RTF wrapped up and waiting for me under the Christmas tree. Got a 6ch simulator and Clearview that I've been practicing with. Won't even bother to take the plane out of the box until the snow melts and the grass is green. Also have a V911 helicopter on the way and a Lanyu mini Cessna en route.

Send some pix of the Corsair. One of the truly great war birds.

[KC9ECI]

Here is the auction: http://www.ebay.com/itm/330842191831

alishanmao flying one http://youtu.be/rEAS_yOnxXM

[K7SGJ]

That's really cool. I find it interesting the guy has a bandaid on his finger. We always had them on several of our fingers, but those were the days of 4"-6" wood or nylon props. Everything was and finger start, too. No electric starters back then. And those bastids hurt like hell, but it was good for improving your dexterity. (on whatever fingers you had left)

[KC9ECI]

I wouldn't be surprised if he has some of the older kit to play with.

I actually bought the F4U myself, but my wife and I thought it would be fun for her to have our 11 year old daughter wrap it up to see how long she can go before she spills the beans. She's been asking me lots of airplane questions the last few days.

[K7SGJ]

Has she asked you about gulls and their wings yet?

[WX7P]

You guys ever see the RC jets?

I was taking my daughter across the Golden Gate Bridge one year and there was someone flying an RC jet from the Marin side.

That thing was amazing.

[N8YX]

You guys ever see the RC jets?

I was taking my daughter across the Golden Gate Bridge one year and there was someone flying an RC jet from the Marin side.

That thing was amazing.

Search for "RC Pulsejets" on Youtube.

When I grow up I want one of those.

[W3WN]

Search for "RC Pulsejets" on Youtube.

When I grow up I want one of those.
You grow up, and I'm tellin' 'DSG on you!

[WX7P]

Search for "RC Pulsejets" on Youtube.

When I grow up I want one of those.


No doubt. The guy I saw "piloting" the plane had that baby almost out to the Farallons.

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&t=h&oe=UTF8&msa=0&msid=205388392728398431813.00048abb95ab4f12c36a6

Zoom out to get an idea of the distance.

[n2ize]

Search for "RC Pulsejets" on Youtube.

When I grow up I want one of those.

It may not have been a pulsejet engine at all. It might have been a true jet turbine engine. They are becoming more popular in the RC hobby these days. They are quite expensive and work just like a full size jet turbine, i.e they use an electric fuel pump, FADEC, on board startup motor to spool the turbine up to speed, temperature sensors, etc. Everything from startup to spool down is controlled via the radio.

Here is one popular brand.

http://www.wrenturbines.co.uk/usa/

Here is a video of an rc jet turbine in action


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPhRhZdwMTg&feature=player_embedded

[ka4dpo]

I can fly any RC plane but Helis are the devil.

[NQ6U]

So, John, if one were looking for an RC helicopter not for hobby purposes but to do some actual work—specifically, lifting a light line over a tree to use it to pull up an heavier line which could in turn be used to pull up a wire antenna—and was only concerned about ease of control, stability and an ability to lift some weight, what kind of machine would you suggest?

[n2ize]

So, John, if one were looking for an RC helicopter not for hobby purposes but to do some actual work—specifically, lifting a light line over a tree to use it to pull up an heavier line which could in turn be used to pull up a wire antenna—and was only concerned about ease of control, stability and an ability to lift some weight, what kind of machine would you suggest?

Uh... that is a tough question. I can't recommend any specific rc heli for such an application. However, I will say that the best suited for such a task would be a large rc helicopter... like a 100 inch rotor span and gas powered or turbine powered would be best for the job. Of course it must be collective pitch so it can deal with wind and the larger the heli the more stable it will be in wind. Other factors would be the skill of the pilot... he had better be very good. Flying and hovering around a field under ideal conditions is different than operating under conditions where there is little or no margin for error. Another factor would be safety. If you have a large property and a crash would be of little consequence, except to your wallet. But, if you have neighbors around you you have to keep in mind that a large rc helicopter crashing or going out of control poses a serious risk to life and/or property. Those things are big, powerful, and can be dangerous.

However, if you can meet the skill, safety (i,e, distance from neighbors, etc.) for industrial rc heli work you might look into a Bergen rc heli which I would recommend.

http://bergenrc.com/

P.S. I thought of the idea of using an rc heli as an "antenna launcher" and quickly determined that a slingshot, bow and arrow, or a rock and a string is safer and more feasible.,

[n2ize]

I can fly any RC plane but Helis are the devil.

Actually I think it's very easy to fly a helicopter. I am of the mindset that anyone can fly a helicopter once they get used to it. I have flown both rc planes and helicopters and while helicopters have a steeper learning curve early on once you get the hang of it it is easy and it stays with you. A friend of mine who flies full size helicopters has the same opinion. Anyone can fly a heli.

[KC9ECI]

You can get one of these. W9UUM was flying it at the NWS.


http://youtu.be/4_w1DWPMxJ8

[KC9ECI]

He uses it here to inspect his antenna.


http://youtu.be/a5mZqmLmSgw

[n2ize]

Yeah, the quad or electric octocopter is a great surveillance platform and far superior to most electric or fuel single rotors. But, when it comes to carrying up lines for an antenna under unfavorable weather conditions I still thing you need a large, collective pitch machine. Then again, the octocopter may deliver that kind of performance.

[KC9ECI]

Weight? Not a problem!


http://youtu.be/g56wwlp4p7s

[N8YX]

Played around with the Helo TC on four different controller platforms yesterday and today:

An iPad (Gen 1);
A Galaxy Tab (Gen 1);
A Xoom Tab (Gen 2);
A Razr Maxx.

The Galaxy seems to work the best for this purpose. All the rest keep popping up that friggin' Google Voice Recognition app at random, which cuts audio to the infrared transmitter attachment and causes the copter to crash.

There is a pronounced dead band when the RC craft is just above the controller in respect to elevation; the entire bird just quits and falls at that point. Since the receiver/controller setup onboard the craft looks PIC based, one wonders why the designers didn't incorporate a routine to shift to a neutral flight attitude and slightly decrease rotor RPM upon loss of transmitter signal. (Heck, we were doing such things mechanically MANY moons ago.)

I'm going to see if there are any modifications to the setup which make it less likely to go haywire.

[n2ize]

Weight? Not a problem!


http://youtu.be/g56wwlp4p7s

Yeah, but how are they in wind ? Since they are marketed as remote surveillance machines they must have good wind stability.

[ka4dpo]

I'm guessing that a 450 electric could hoist a 30 lb test mono fillament line over a tree provided the line is absolutely free and you really know how to fly one well. Also, if the line were to get hung up in tree fro any reason even a large .90 glow powered heli would bite the dust. Stick with a slingshot or bow and arrow.

[K7SGJ]

So, John, if one were looking for an RC helicopter not for hobby purposes but to do some actual work—specifically, lifting a light line over a tree to use it to pull up an heavier line which could in turn be used to pull up a wire antenna—and was only concerned about ease of control, stability and an ability to lift some weight, what kind of machine would you suggest?


Hello

A pink RC Bell, of course.

[KC9ECI]

FYI, a cheap source of parts: http://www.hobbyking.com

[n2ize]

Here is also a good place for parts, kits, and rtf stuff as well as for LiPo batteries etc...

http://www.hobbypartz.com/

[KC9ECI]

Nice, thanks.