So, what is this all about?

[KB3ZGV]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qo-1_Hmu7aM

Is that thing really 15 KW?

This kind of thing didn't exist when I was into CB in the early 70's It's got to be total homebrew. I get the impression that it's got to be dirty, but if these guys are in competition, wouldn't they want all their power in a tight frequency range?


BTW, on a related subject. I was listening to 75M the other night, and some guys were talking about some ham they called "Jersey Joe" who got caught running 28 KW. Is that something that really happened, or is it just a tall tale that keeps getting bigger?

[KB3ZGV]

Oh, and why is the older Chevy Suburban the rolling platform of choice for these guys? It seems like they all use them.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuvBHTcb4is

[WA4TM]

AFAIK,,, They are big = small penis = (same deal as the sh**ty amps)

The have room under the hood for extra alternators and silly stuff that goes with the big amps...

[KB3LAZ]

Them there is for road hunting, umhm.

[KJ3N]

Shouldn't this be in the CB forum?

[W3WN]

Shouldn't this be in the CB forum?Yes it should.

Joe, you know it was posts like this that got you into hot water over yonder. C'mon.

And did any of the Pack Rats get ahold of you, or did that fall by the wayside?

[ad4mg]

Shouldn't this be in the CB forum?

Yup. Relocation complete.

It's OK, no trouble to move it, and new members may not know all the forums like we curmudgeons do...

[KJ3N]

Yup. Relocation complete.

Danke. Now I can ignore it completely. ;) :lol:

[KJ3N]

One parting comment to answer the question:


So, what is this all about?

Small penis compensation.

You're welcome.

[WØTKX]

Moar Power?

http://www.southyorkshirerepeatergroup.co.uk/blogg/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/ka0xtt.jpg

[n2ize]

Oh, and why is the older Chevy Suburban the rolling platform of choice for these guys? It seems like they all use them.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuvBHTcb4is

I could never understand these videos. I've seen a few of them and it's always the same. Nothing happens. What the heck are they trying to accomplish ?

[wa6mhz]

I have seen some chickenbanders on YOUTUBE doing 75 KW!!!!

15KW is QRP!

[N8YX]

BTW, on a related subject. I was listening to 75M the other night, and some guys were talking about some ham they called "Jersey Joe" who got caught running 28 KW. Is that something that really happened, or is it just a tall tale that keeps getting bigger?
There have been a couple individuals over the years who have been cited for running high power on 75M. An account of one of the busts was featured on Eham; the guy who worked the case stated the violator was using a Drake L4B running 2KW PEP output as a driver. This was back during the "horseracing" days on 3895; mid 70s to early 80s.

I have heard tales regarding a few call signs that were associated with the bust in question, and two of those are in my log from the period. Never could pin any of them down.

Another account from a somewhat reliable source concerns a discovery in Texas. Lifelong bachelor goes SK; friends and relatives dismantle station...find amplifier whose plate power supply takes 440v/3ph power at 75A per leg. Unit was located in an enclosure the size of a small utility building; was so well designed and constructed that it was placed aboard a truck then sent to one of the VOA sites as a backup transmitter.

FWIW.


Oh, and why is the older Chevy Suburban the rolling platform of choice for these guys? It seems like they all use them.

Space in back for smoothing capacitors and batteries for the "motor maul" and final amplifier (DC Sky class), for the driver and main amplifier power supplies (AC Sky class), room under the hood for a shitload of Leece-Neville 250A train alternators, a 4-bolt 454 and the nitrous setup required to generate the power levels needed to spin the alternators when under load.

You ain't fittin' all that in the boot of a VW.

[WØTKX]

With care and consideration, a person can run a LOT of power very clean, and nobody really cares.

[N8YX]

With care and consideration, a person can run a LOT of power very clean, and nobody really cares.

Said gent in Tejas was never suspected of running as much as he was thought to have on-hand...something about not making an ass of one's self while on the air comes to mind.

[KB3ZGV]

So do they just do these crazy contests with these things, or do they park on the beach somewhere and freeband dx too?

[N8YX]

So do they just do these crazy contests with these things, or do they park on the beach somewhere and freeband dx too?

The keydown rigs are built with the same design ethos which a top-fuel dragster is: Full power for just a few seconds before you shut 'er off.

And with a similar goal in mind: Money. None of the participants do this for free, and though I've never been to one of these events I understand that some pretty serious money has been known to change hands in the "Sky" (sky's the limit) power class.

What constitutes "normal" DXing is done from the comfort of one's home, or with the mobile at vastly reduced power. Even a different amp, as the majority of the contest stuff is Class C - and is a sure-fire way to attract unwanted attention from other spectrum users.

[KA9MOT]

I used to care about this shit when I was a new ham.... I could could give a shit now as long as they aren't interfering with 10M and 6M. Let them fry their nuts, their business.

[N8YX]

I used to care about this shit when I was a new ham.... I could could give a shit now as long as they aren't interfering with 10M and 6M. Let them fry their nuts, their business.
Ergo my comments about the Class C stuff. If I hear you on 10 and/or 12M - directly or indirectly, as a result of a mis-constructed amplifier or mis-tuned/poorly designed transceiver - you will get found and you will get reported. Since the FCC has pretty much washed its hands of Part 97 enforcement duties and has instead turned that role over to the local constabulary, a bug in their ear regarding the illegal operator has been known to get traction...

[K7SGJ]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qo-1_Hmu7aM

Is that thing really 15 KW?

This kind of thing didn't exist when I was into CB in the early 70's It's got to be total homebrew. I get the impression that it's got to be dirty, but if these guys are in competition, wouldn't they want all their power in a tight frequency range?


BTW, on a related subject. I was listening to 75M the other night, and some guys were talking about some ham they called "Jersey Joe" who got caught running 28 KW. Is that something that really happened, or is it just a tall tale that keeps getting bigger?

So what is it all about?

Why the hokie pokie, everyone knows that. You put your left foot in, you take your left foot out, you........................well....you get the idea.

[koØm]

Oh, and why is the older Chevy Suburban the rolling platform of choice for these guys? It seems like they all use them.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuvBHTcb4is

One reason that they prefer the older platform is that the engines in them have less computer controlled functions; points versus electronic ignition. There is also a "Ledgendary" GM Stroker 383 Engine that they modify that will suppositly out perform the big block 454 cu.in. jobs.

The L4-B is a "QRP" driver for a mini-QRO station doing 15K on a "Burd-Meter with a 25K slug (on a fixed station).

50Kw portable stations (mobiles) do exist; they are like drag racers and even get hauled around on flatbed trucks to the different venues. Stations capable of operating over 50kw exist but, I have never been involved with those operators.

.

[K7SGJ]

One reason that they prefer the older platform is that the engines in them have less computer controlled functions; points versus electronic ignition. There is also a "Ledgendary" GM Stroker 383 Engine that they modify that will suppositly out perform the big block 454 cu.in. jobs.

The L4-B is a "QRP" driver for a mini-QRO station doing 15K on a "Burd-Meter with a 25K slug (on a fixed station).

50Kw portable stations (mobiles) do exist; they are like drag racers and even get hauled around on flatbed trucks to the different venues. Stations capable of operating over 50kw exist but, I have never been involved with those operators.

.

And I imagine the operators nut sack look like it contains a couple of shriveled up raisins.

[N2CHX]

So the only point to all this is a dead carrier for a few seconds? Why even transmit into an antenna then?

[koØm]

And I imagine the operators nut sack look like it contains a couple of shriveled up raisins.

By the time you can afford that setup, your baby-making days are over with already anyway.

'Probably just a coincidence that the owner of that 15KW fixed station is dependent on Viagra for his other "fun" ;-)

[N2CHX]

I've worked quite closely with high power transmitters most of my adult life. Not a big deal. The only time I would say I felt unsafe was in the CH8 building on Pinnacle Hill in Rochester. In the stairwell to the 2nd floor was a hotspot for a long time until some antennas were changed out (now moot because of HD, I'm sure). Anyway, if you stood in this one spot in the stairwell you could feel it. Literally feel it. If I was on that hill for more than 1/2 hour I'd get a wicked headache. For a long time I thought it was the sound of the blowers, but then I realized I didn't get the headache at other sites that were just as loud, so I tested it by standing just outside the building for a while. It was the RF. There were four or five Class B FM's up there, plus several VHF and UHF TV transmitters and a crapload of 2-way.

[koØm]

So the only point to all this is a dead carrier for a few seconds? Why even transmit into an antenna then?

No, no, no......They have a fixed station 20+ miles down the road with a "Watergate" (tape recorder), a Yellow-Green-Red Stop-light and a Referee to manage the show. The results are based on the taped recordings.

Teams have been caught cheating when it was detected that they had placed a member with a 2 meter rig on the receiving end and an other member in the bushes with a Highly directional 2 meter antenna (at the shoot-out spot) so that they can aim their highly directional antenna array atop the vehicles.

....On the receiving end, some stations are conveniently of frequency in the same direction and amount as certain stations in the shoot-out; Audio Equalizers and If shift, etc.

In lower classes ( less than Sky's-da-limit ) , the trucks are "inspected" for hidden amps from radio to antenna.

Money is bet.

.

[N2CHX]

No, no, no......They have a fixed station 20+ miles down the road with a "Watergate" (tape recorder), a Yellow-Green-Red Stop-light and a Referee to manage the show. The results are based on the taped recordings.

Teams have been caught cheating when it was detected that they had placed a member with a 2 meter rig on the receiving end and an other member in the bushes with a Highly directional 2 meter antenna (at the shoot-out spot) so that they can aim their highly directional antenna array atop the vehicles.

....On the receiving end, some stations are conveniently of frequency in the same direction and amount as certain stations in the shoot-out; Audio Equalizers and If shift, etc.

In lower classes ( less than Sky's-da-limit ) , the trucks are "inspected" for hidden amps from radio to antenna.

Money is bet.

.

Weird. Not my cup of tea, but OK. Of course, I'm sure a lot of people think my building QRP beacons on 22 and 1750 meters is weird too. It is, but that's beside the point :p

[n2ize]

No, no, no......They have a fixed station 20+ miles down the road with a "Watergate" (tape recorder), a Yellow-Green-Red Stop-light and a Referee to manage the show. The results are based on the taped recordings.

Teams have been caught cheating when it was detected that they had placed a member with a 2 meter rig on the receiving end and an other member in the bushes with a Highly directional 2 meter antenna (at the shoot-out spot) so that they can aim their highly directional antenna array atop the vehicles.

....On the receiving end, some stations are conveniently of frequency in the same direction and amount as certain stations in the shoot-out; Audio Equalizers and If shift, etc.

In lower classes ( less than Sky's-da-limit ) , the trucks are "inspected" for hidden amps from radio to antenna.

Money is bet.

.
This sounds like it could be fun. I would even consider getting into this if I lived in the south. Plus with big money riding on it there is incentive. Wonder if I could build up a 3000+ Kw keydown station. That would be almost as powerful as HAARP. Might win me a few keydowns.

[KB3ZGV]

I can see the older platform being pre-electronic being an advantage. I don't see them needing more than stock power though. Well maybe, depending on the class. Usually the rule of thumb is 2 HP in to make a KW out with generators.

What kind of input power does an amplifier need per KW out?

That crazy idea with all the L-N 2500 JB alternators on a belt drive is crazy though. I guess they are using the 2500 JB because the output of the bridge rectifier isn't grounded to the frame allowing them to be connected in series for higher voltages.

Personally I think being that they are 4 wheel drive I'd disconnect the rear driveshaft and drive a large generator off the back of the transfer case. Then I'd just use the front differential to move the thing around.

They aren't running those amplifiers off of 12 VDC are they? I can't imagine what kind of I^2R losses they would have running at such a low voltage

[KA9MOT]

One reason that they prefer the older platform is that the engines in them have less computer controlled functions; points versus electronic ignition. There is also a "Ledgendary" GM Stroker 383 Engine that they modify that will suppositly out perform the big block 454 cu.in. jobs.

The L4-B is a "QRP" driver for a mini-QRO station doing 15K on a "Burd-Meter with a 25K slug (on a fixed station).

50Kw portable stations (mobiles) do exist; they are like drag racers and even get hauled around on flatbed trucks to the different venues. Stations capable of operating over 50kw exist but, I have never been involved with those operators.

.

Both of those Suburbans have electronic ignitions. NOBODY, regardless of mental retardation level would go BACK to points.
GM Never made a 383 CID engine. The 383 is a 350 block with 400 internals (Crank, Flywheel) and something an engine builder builds. It is capable of very good power, and would be more powerful than a stock 454 but certainly would not be refered to as "Legendary". A properly built 454 would spank it's mouse motor ass.

Legendary engines: 1970 Chevy 350 (only year), 1970 LS-6 and LS-7 454 CID Big Block Chevy, 1964 Ford 427 SOHC "Cammer", Ford's Boss 302 and 429 and of course Chrysler's Hemi. Not a complete list, but I am sure it gives you an idea.....

[KB3ZGV]

I was never a real fan of the 383 stroker design. The rods are too short and the piston velocity is way too high at the top of the stroke.

I think you are better off using a 400 small block with it's 4.125" bore and the shorter 350 or even the 327 large journal crank. Then turn it up tight as all hell.

But anyway for this radio dragster application, the small block's light weight is really of no advantage.

In fact they would be better off with an engine with a large rotating mass for the energy storage provided by the mass.

I still don't see this running out of power thing though. I've had box stock 429 fords running on natural gas (think derated) powering 100 KW 100% duty cycle generators at 1800 RPM.

[KA9MOT]

572 CID (Stroked 454) Big Block Chebby! I'd put that engine is something else and go to the drag strip!



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVlbK13vD2k&feature=share&list=ULnVlbK13vD 2k

[KA9MOT]

Look at all of those alternators.


http://youtu.be/FZ9u4hMV70M

[N8YX]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGPLz2nX0GM

[KB3ZGV]

Both of those Suburbans have electronic ignitions. NOBODY, regardless of mental retardation level would go BACK to points.
GM Never made a 383 CID engine. The 383 is a 350 block with 400 internals (Crank, Flywheel) and something an engine builder builds. It is capable of very good power, and would be more powerful than a stock 454 but certainly would not be refered to as "Legendary". A properly built 454 would spank it's mouse motor ass.

Legendary engines: 1970 Chevy 350 (only year), 1970 LS-6 and LS-7 454 CID Big Block Chevy, 1964 Ford 427 SOHC "Cammer", Ford's Boss 302 and 429 and of course Chrysler's Hemi. Not a complete list, but I am sure it gives you an idea.....

It's funny, with HEI being around 40 years, I almost fail to think of them as "Electronic Engines"

I'd never go back to Pre-HEI

[KA9MOT]

I love this guys air cleaner hold down nut. That same tube would make a super cool shifter knob.


http://youtu.be/a09d2_2mRjU

Can ya believe these people spend this kind of money on this stuff?

[KA9MOT]

It's funny, with HEI being around 40 years, I almost fail to think of them as "Electronic Engines"

I'd never go back to Pre-HEI

I used the GM 4 pin ignition module on many of my early Fords, My GoldWing and 1 Volvo. They were foolproof and when coupled with the right coil, would throw a spark for inches.

Here is one I did on a 1984 Ford Bronco II:

http://twoguysgarage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=57845&postcount=3

http://twoguysgarage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=61975&postcount=10

http://twoguysgarage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=61977&postcount=11

That whole thread if you're interested:

http://twoguysgarage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6149

[KB3ZGV]

You know I'm just not seeing it with all these belt driben alternators.

Something like a drive motor from a big electric forklift driven off the harmonic balancer with a driveshaft. Kinda like the way the hyd pump is driven on a concrete mixer seems better.

Although most of the drive motors for electric forklifts are series wound. You could probably work some shunt wound fields into them for closer voltage control.

Hmmmmmmm,,,,,,,,,,

[KB3ZGV]

I used the GM 4 pin ignition module on many of my early Fords, My GoldWing and 1 Volvo. They were foolproof and when coupled with the right coil, would throw a spark for inches.

Here is one I did on a 1984 Ford Bronco II:

http://twoguysgarage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=57845&postcount=3

http://twoguysgarage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=61975&postcount=10

http://twoguysgarage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=61977&postcount=11

That whole thread if you're interested:

http://twoguysgarage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6149

That's pretty cool. I never thought about it, but why not? That 4 pin HEI module is pretty bulletproof

[K7SGJ]

I've worked quite closely with high power transmitters most of my adult life. Not a big deal. The only time I would say I felt unsafe was in the CH8 building on Pinnacle Hill in Rochester. In the stairwell to the 2nd floor was a hotspot for a long time until some antennas were changed out (now moot because of HD, I'm sure). Anyway, if you stood in this one spot in the stairwell you could feel it. Literally feel it. If I was on that hill for more than 1/2 hour I'd get a wicked headache. For a long time I thought it was the sound of the blowers, but then I realized I didn't get the headache at other sites that were just as loud, so I tested it by standing just outside the building for a while. It was the RF. There were four or five Class B FM's up there, plus several VHF and UHF TV transmitters and a crapload of 2-way.

I had similar experiences. Pretty much all the TV and FMs are on South Mountain in Phoenix, along with a zillion two way users. Our building had two full power TVs Ch8 (PBS) and Ch12 (NBC), and our 100KW FM in it. When I had to spend any amount of time up there, I got violent headaches. We had the antenna flash over one night, We had to replace the antenna, all the hard line from the combiner to the transmitters, hardline to the top of the tower, and rebuild the transfer switch. It took close to 2 weeks solid and I thought I was going to stroke out. Lots of RF is bad pucky. When you are on the tower near all three antennas, you can feel the heat and almost hear your cells mutate.

[n2ize]

I've worked quite closely with high power transmitters most of my adult life. Not a big deal. The only time I would say I felt unsafe was in the CH8 building on Pinnacle Hill in Rochester. In the stairwell to the 2nd floor was a hotspot for a long time until some antennas were changed out (now moot because of HD, I'm sure). Anyway, if you stood in this one spot in the stairwell you could feel it. Literally feel it. If I was on that hill for more than 1/2 hour I'd get a wicked headache. For a long time I thought it was the sound of the blowers, but then I realized I didn't get the headache at other sites that were just as loud, so I tested it by standing just outside the building for a while. It was the RF. There were four or five Class B FM's up there, plus several VHF and UHF TV transmitters and a crapload of 2-way.

Well, at least it wasn't ionizing radiation. Still, if the field is strong enough where you can actually feel the heat it isn't doing you any good, that's for sure.

In my late 20's and early 30's I used to hang out at the old WNEW AM transmitter site (now underwater) in the New Jersey swamps. Perhaps this was merely coincidence but I started noticing that every time I would go there after about a half hour I would start feeling extremely tired. That tired feeling would go away gradually after I left.

[kb2vxa]

It wasn't the RF, it was the gas. (;->) Seriously, if you look up exposure limits you'll see they're related to frequency, it all has to do with resonances within the body. That's why a cockroach wanders about merrily in a microwave oven, it's smaller than a wavelength. I don't know the figures for AM broadcasting but minimum distances from the tower are rather small. I remember wandering around the WOON site while others were dismantling the Collins 20V-2 for its ride to New Jersey, the tower was enclosed by a fence set back two feet. The CE told me not to go inside the fence, I told him not to worry as I could see everything from outside.

Reading about those RF hot spots at transmitter sites and feeling heat while doing tower work tells me something is terribly wrong. There should be no hot spots anywhere on the property, that smells of some heavy duty leakage. Why heat on the tower I don't know, practice is to lower transmitter power to safe limits while persons are up there.

Oh that reminds me of another reason you felt tired, was the air monitor on? There were times WNEW played elevator music, audio anesthesia. (;->)

[n2ize]

It wasn't the RF, it was the gas. (;->)

Yes that ^^




Oh that reminds me of another reason you felt tired, was the air monitor on? There were times WNEW played elevator music, audio anesthesia. (;->)

^^ That too. Yes the air monitor was always on. It was continuous.

And maybe whatever else was in that swamp.. ;)

BTW I brought a Geiger with me once and poked around the swamp but never found anything radioactive there.... I

[X-Rated]

It wasn't the RF, it was the gas. (;->) ... (;->)

I hear that VXA gas is quite deadly.

[KE5YPJ]

I swear I saw one of theese on duck dynasty or mabye that was deliverance.

[kb2vxa]

You can't see VXA gas but you can hear the duck.