Winter Lager

[n2ize]

Just tried some Samuel Adams "Winter Lager". Damned is that stuff good. It's a nice spicy dark bock beer with a complex but rich pleasant flavour. Good stuff.

[kb2crk]

I enjoy most of Sam Adams seasonal beers. They can keep their Boston Lager.

[n2ize]

I enjoy most of Sam Adams seasonal beers. They can keep their Boston Lager.

Yeah, I remember trying the Boston Lager and I didn't find it particularly great, although it is still better than most of the old main brands. But their seasonal beers are excellent and the winter lager is awesome. I hope it stays around through the holidays.

Back when I lived in Brooklyn Piels was a great beer, brewed locally, had a nice rich body and flavour. Too bad I wasn't legally allowed to drink it yet but it was good. Then like all the Major beer labels it was bought, sold , merged, resold, re-merged and along the way it turned to crap as did so many once good beers like Miller, Lowenbrau, Bud, Reingold and Ballantine.

I am really thankful that companies like Sam Adams revived the concept of good beer and lots of other companies followed suit. These days "Brooklyn Ale" is one of my favorites. But this sam Adams winter brew is a close runner up.

[NQ6U]

I enjoy most of Sam Adams seasonal beers. They can keep their Boston Lager.

Boston Lager beats the pants of Budweiser, not that that's saying much.

John, if you can find it in your area, try a bottle of Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale. Good stuff, excellent for cooking with as well.

[NY4Q]

One winter the CO brewery New Belgium brewed up one called 2 below. I liked that better than their Fat Tire Ale.

[n2ize]

Boston Lager beats the pants of Budweiser, not that that's saying much.

John, if you can find it in your area, try a bottle of Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale. Good stuff, excellent for cooking with as well.

Budweiser these days is little more than salty water. I'll keep an eye our for the Sierra Nevada. Not sure of its availability here.

[HUGH]

Hmm, a dark lager, versus ale or beer, seems unusual until I remind myself it's only the difference between top & bottom fermenting yeasts.

[n2ize]

Hmm, a dark lager, versus ale or beer, seems unusual until I remind myself it's only the difference between top & bottom fermenting yeasts.
Is that the main difference ? Now when we speak of an ale versus a beer what is the difference there ? I was always sort of confused between the different terms, beer, ale, lager, stout, etc. All I know is the ale's and beer's tend to be lighter while the lagers tend to be darker.

[NQ6U]

In California, at least, "beer" and "ale" are strictly legalistic terms that refer to the alcohol content. In this state, if it's got more than a certain percentage of alcohol, you can't call it "beer." You can call it "ale," however, no matter which type of yeast is used in the brewing process.

Go figure, laws here concerning adult beverages are arcane to say the least. You can, however, buy pretty much anything you want at any store with the appropriate liquor license between 6 AM and 2 AM seven days a week.

[n2ize]

In California, at least, "beer" and "ale" are strictly legalistic terms that refer to the alcohol content. In this state, if it's got more than a certain percentage of alcohol, you can't call it "beer." You can call it "ale," however, no matter which type of yeast is used in the brewing process.

Go figure, laws here concerning adult beverages are arcane to say the least. You can, however, buy pretty much anything you want at any store with the appropriate liquor license between 6 AM and 2 AM seven days a week.

Same thing here, there are a lot of strange laws. For instance beer can be sold in supermarkets but not wines or liquors. Wine and liquor stores can open on Sunday and holidays but not until a certain time as the morning hours are for church. I think there are also laws governing what time a store can open if it lies within a certain distance of a church. And it differs from state to state, NY is different than Jersey, Connecticut if different the NY and NJ, etc. Lot of it is holdover crap from the old days.

[kb2crk]

Lager and Ale are the type of brewing process.
Had a Sam Adams Cherry Wheat with the turkey dinner...

[n2ize]

Lager and Ale are the type of brewing process.
Had a Sam Adams Cherry Wheat with the turkey dinner...
Sounds nice. I just finished the last of the Winter Lager. Got to get some more of this soon. No. haven't had dinner yet. The turkey didn't get in the oven till late so it will probably be a few more hours. Luckily we have plenty of room here and our guests can spend the night here.

[KC9ECI]

I had a turkey pot pie and some oj mixed with cranberry and vodka.

[KC2UGV]

Yeah, the winter lager is pretty good, along with their cherry wheat.

[kf0rt]

Same thing here, there are a lot of strange laws. For instance beer can be sold in supermarkets but not wines or liquors. Wine and liquor stores can open on Sunday and holidays but not until a certain time as the morning hours are for church. I think there are also laws governing what time a store can open if it lies within a certain distance of a church. And it differs from state to state, NY is different than Jersey, Connecticut if different the NY and NJ, etc. Lot of it is holdover crap from the old days.

In Colorado, you can only buy 3.2 beer in grocery or convenience stores. Weird laws. Can't buy any alcohol unless you're 21, so the 3.2 stuff is kinda dumb. Every grocery store here has a liquor store next door. In South Dakota, the grocery stores have liquor aisles, but the high school girl running the checkout counter needs to round up an "adult" to sell it to ya.

I guess 2 AM to 6 AM are the "sober hours?" (Same here.) Be fun to see the research on that one.

[kf0rt]

I had a turkey pot pie and some oj mixed with cranberry and vodka.

The carbs in that pot pie will kill ya. ;)

[NQ6U]

In Colorado, you can only buy 3.2 beer in grocery or convenience stores. Weird laws. Can't buy any alcohol unless you're 21, so the 3.2 stuff is kinda dumb.

In California, there are two types of off-sale liquor licenses: one for wine and beer, another for distilled spirits. The former is relatively easy (if expensive) to get, the latter almost literally takes an act of God in that there are a limited number available and the way that they are most frequently obtained is when a former license holder kicks the bucket. No limits on what a store can sell other than it must be within the scope of their particular license, plus the 2-6 am curfew.

There are also similar licenses for restaurants but holders of those are not legally permitted to allow customers take any alcohol off the premises. It's a stupid rule, really, since it means that people tend to linger and finish off their wine (and, as a result, leave drunk) rather than leave a partial bottle on the table. I remember being surprised when visiting Oregon a few years back and finding out that it was okay to take my half-empty bottle of wine back to the motel room. Very civilized, I thought.


In South Dakota, the grocery stores have liquor aisles, but the high school girl running the checkout counter needs to round up an "adult" to sell it to ya.

Same deal here, it's kind of funny. Most supermarkets only hire people over 21 as checkers just for that reason.


I guess 2 AM to 6 AM are the "sober hours?" (Same here.) Be fun to see the research on that one.

I've always wondered about this one. I guess the idea is that it forces drunks to go home and get some sleep. Yeah, right.

[NA4BH]

Alabama recently passed a law that allows the higher alcohol content beer and containers larger than 16oz. So smaller breweries craft beer is popping up on the shelf. Locally (a town south of here), a micro brewery just opened and his stuff is pretty good. In Alabama a micro brewery can only open in an economically depressed area. His next batch will be in the 9% to 10% alcohol range. The best part of this, he is a good friend. Liquor stores are 99% State owned. Walgreens/CVS and such sell beer and wine. Bars close at 2am. We are slowly, very slowly, getting Sunday sales popping up around the State. You watch, they will go full Sunday sales the day after I die. THE BASTIDS.

ETA: You can always tell who the Baptists are at the liquor store, they always look at the floor while in the store. They don't want to have to say hi to their preacher. LOL True Story

[n2ize]

In Colorado, you can only buy 3.2 beer in grocery or convenience stores. Weird laws. Can't buy any alcohol unless you're 21, so the 3.2 stuff is kinda dumb. Every grocery store here has a liquor store next door. In South Dakota, the grocery stores have liquor aisles, but the high school girl running the checkout counter needs to round up an "adult" to sell it to ya.


I guess 2 AM to 6 AM are the "sober hours?" (Same here.) Be fun to see the research on that one.
In New York City alcohol can be served in bars and nightclubs till 4:00am. I am not sure about liquor stores and / or how late they can remain open. Then there are those unofficial night clubs that stay open all night and serve alcohol, among other things, all night long.

[KC9ECI]

The carbs in that pot pie will kill ya. ;)

Yeah, but it was so delicious that I was soon over the disappointment of discovering it didn't really contain any marijuana.

[kf0rt]

Yeah, but it was so delicious that I was soon over the disappointment of discovering it didn't really contain any marijuana.

Bazinga! :rofl:

[kf0rt]

In California, there are two types of off-sale liquor licenses: one for wine and beer, another for distilled spirits. The former is relatively easy (if expensive) to get, the latter almost literally takes an act of God in that there are a limited number available and the way that they are most frequently obtained is when a former license holder kicks the bucket. No limits on what a store can sell other than it must be within the scope of their particular license, plus the 2-6 am curfew.

There are also similar licenses for restaurants but holders of those are not legally permitted to allow customers take any alcohol off the premises. It's a stupid rule, really, since it means that people tend to linger and finish off their wine (and, as a result, leave drunk) rather than leave a partial bottle on the table. I remember being surprised when visiting Oregon a few years back and finding out that it was okay to take my half-empty bottle of wine back to the motel room. Very civilized, I thought.


Sounds like CA and CO laws are about the same.

I recall being in one of the casinos here some years back and you couldn't even walk between them with a drink, even though it didn't even require going "outside." In fact, if it wasn't for the drink law, a normal person might think it was just one casino. Weird stuff, and it's only been in the last 10-15 years (IIRC) that liquor sales have been permitted on Sundays and Election Day.

[kf0rt]

In Alabama a micro brewery can only open in an economically depressed area.

There'a joke in there somewhere, but it's escaping me at the moment.

[HUGH]

I think the colour and flavour depends partly on how well the barley is roasted or what colour the malt extract is if you make it that way. What you add to it after, such as liquorice, brown sugar &c is important too. Stout brewers can add oatmeal or wheat and lager brewers rice or unroasted barley.

I reckon there should be university degrees in brewing, anyway here's a nice guide:

Yeast Guide
Yeast are single-celled microorganisms that reproduce by budding. They are biologically classified as fungi and are responsible for converting fermentable sugars into alcohol and other byproducts. There are literally hundreds of varieties and strains of yeast. In the past, there were two types of beer yeast: ale yeast (the "top-fermenting" type, Saccharomyces cerevisiae) and lager yeast (the "bottom-fermenting" type, Saccharomyces uvarum, formerly known as Saccharomyces carlsbergensis). Today, as a result of recent reclassification of Saccharomyces species, both ale and lager yeast strains are considered to be members of S. cerevisiae.

Top-Fermenting Yeast
Ale yeast strains are best used at temperatures ranging from 10 to 25°C, though some strains will not actively ferment below 12°C (33). Ale yeasts are generally regarded as top-fermenting yeasts since they rise to the surface during fermentation, creating a very thick, rich yeast head. That is why the term "top-fermenting" is associated with ale yeasts. Fermentation by ale yeasts at these relatively warmer temperatures produces a beer high in esters, which many regard as a distinctive character of ale beers.

Top-fermenting yeasts are used for brewing ales, porters, stouts, Altbier, Kölsch, and wheat beers.

Bottom-Fermenting Yeast
Lager yeast strains are best used at temperatures ranging from 7 to 15°C. At these temperatures, lager yeasts grow less rapidly than ale yeasts, and with less surface foam they tend to settle out to the bottom of the fermenter as fermentation nears completion. This is why they are often referred to as "bottom" yeasts. The final flavour of the beer will depend a great deal on the strain of lager yeast and the temperatures at which it was fermented.

Some of the lager styles made from bottom-fermenting yeasts are Pilsners, Dortmunders, Märzen, Bocks, and American malt liquors.

Spontaneous Fermentation
Beer that is exposed to the surrounding open air to allow natural/wild yeast and bacteria to literally infect the beer, are spontaneous fermented beers. One of the typical yeasts is the Brettanomyces Lambicus strain. Beers produced in this fashion are sour, non-filtered and inspired by the traditional lambics of the Zenne-region. This brewing method has been practised for decades in the West Flanders region of Belgium.

Byproducts of Yeast
Yeast impact the flavour and aroma of beer more than you might think. The flavour and aroma of beer is very complex, being derived from a vast array of components that arise from a number of sources. Not only do malt, hops, and water have an impact on flavour, so does the synthesis of yeast, which forms byproducts during fermentation and maturation. The most notable of these byproducts are, of course, ethanol (alcohol) and carbon dioxide (CO2); but in addition, a large number of other flavour compounds are produced such as:

acetaldehyde (green apple aroma)
diacetyl (taste or aroma of buttery, butterscotch)
dimethyl sulfide (DMS) (taste or aroma of sweet corn, cooked veggies)
clove (spicy character reminiscent of cloves)
fruity / estery (flavour and aroma of bananas, strawberries, apples, or other fruit)
medicinal (chemical or phenolic character)
phenolic (flavour and aroma of medicine, plastic, Band-Aids, smoke, or cloves)
solvent (reminiscent of acetone or lacquer thinner)
sulfur (reminiscent of rotten eggs or burnt matches)

There are other yeast byproducts, and some of the listed can be both desired byproducts and/or undesired depending on the beer style or what the brewer was trying to achieve.

[kb2crk]

I bought a Sam Adams winter sampler pack Saturday and tried the winter lager when I got home. Very good dark lager. I am trying their White Christmas ale right now. Very tasty for a white ale.

[kb2crk]

Tonight was a Holiday Porter... Another good beer

[n2ize]

I think the colour and flavour depends partly on how well the barley is roasted or what colour the malt extract is if you make it that way. What you add to it after, such as liquorice, brown sugar &c is important too. Stout brewers can add oatmeal or wheat and lager brewers rice or unroasted barley.

I reckon there should be university degrees in brewing, anyway here's a nice guide:

Yeast Guide
Yeast are single-celled microorganisms that reproduce by budding. They are biologically classified as fungi and are responsible for converting fermentable sugars into alcohol and other byproducts. There are literally hundreds of varieties and strains of yeast. In the past, there were two types of beer yeast: ale yeast (the "top-fermenting" type, Saccharomyces cerevisiae) and lager yeast (the "bottom-fermenting" type, Saccharomyces uvarum, formerly known as Saccharomyces carlsbergensis). Today, as a result of recent reclassification of Saccharomyces species, both ale and lager yeast strains are considered to be members of S. cerevisiae.

Top-Fermenting Yeast
Ale yeast strains are best used at temperatures ranging from 10 to 25°C, though some strains will not actively ferment below 12°C (33). Ale yeasts are generally regarded as top-fermenting yeasts since they rise to the surface during fermentation, creating a very thick, rich yeast head. That is why the term "top-fermenting" is associated with ale yeasts. Fermentation by ale yeasts at these relatively warmer temperatures produces a beer high in esters, which many regard as a distinctive character of ale beers.

Top-fermenting yeasts are used for brewing ales, porters, stouts, Altbier, Kölsch, and wheat beers.

Bottom-Fermenting Yeast
Lager yeast strains are best used at temperatures ranging from 7 to 15°C. At these temperatures, lager yeasts grow less rapidly than ale yeasts, and with less surface foam they tend to settle out to the bottom of the fermenter as fermentation nears completion. This is why they are often referred to as "bottom" yeasts. The final flavour of the beer will depend a great deal on the strain of lager yeast and the temperatures at which it was fermented.

Some of the lager styles made from bottom-fermenting yeasts are Pilsners, Dortmunders, Märzen, Bocks, and American malt liquors.

Spontaneous Fermentation
Beer that is exposed to the surrounding open air to allow natural/wild yeast and bacteria to literally infect the beer, are spontaneous fermented beers. One of the typical yeasts is the Brettanomyces Lambicus strain. Beers produced in this fashion are sour, non-filtered and inspired by the traditional lambics of the Zenne-region. This brewing method has been practised for decades in the West Flanders region of Belgium.

Byproducts of Yeast
Yeast impact the flavour and aroma of beer more than you might think. The flavour and aroma of beer is very complex, being derived from a vast array of components that arise from a number of sources. Not only do malt, hops, and water have an impact on flavour, so does the synthesis of yeast, which forms byproducts during fermentation and maturation. The most notable of these byproducts are, of course, ethanol (alcohol) and carbon dioxide (CO2); but in addition, a large number of other flavour compounds are produced such as:

acetaldehyde (green apple aroma)
diacetyl (taste or aroma of buttery, butterscotch)
dimethyl sulfide (DMS) (taste or aroma of sweet corn, cooked veggies)
clove (spicy character reminiscent of cloves)
fruity / estery (flavour and aroma of bananas, strawberries, apples, or other fruit)
medicinal (chemical or phenolic character)
phenolic (flavour and aroma of medicine, plastic, Band-Aids, smoke, or cloves)
solvent (reminiscent of acetone or lacquer thinner)
sulfur (reminiscent of rotten eggs or burnt matches)

There are other yeast byproducts, and some of the listed can be both desired byproducts and/or undesired depending on the beer style or what the brewer was trying to achieve.

This is a great post. Thanks. I made a copy of it to keep handy for reference,