Finally! Seeing steroscopic 3D vision in the MS Flight Simulator, FSX.

[W1GUH]

(Ducking) - Adds a whole new dimension to the experience. Literally and figuratively!

OK -- wanted that so bad I couldn't leave this machine, and especially it's nvidia 560M graphics alone. After I finally figured out how to get the 560M control panel to let me enable 3D vision (outlined in another thread), I started messing with the settings and setup. I DON'T have a 3D ready TV.

But, for some reason, a "not ready for 3D" TV, when plugged into the HDMI port on this computer, satisfies nvidia & it'll enable 3D vision. The first thing to do after getting it enabled is to set it up in the 3D setup wizard. What that does is shows you screens and asks you what you see. From your answers it determines if your 3D is working OK or not.

Well, mine wasn't. Of course it wasn't - I don't have a 3D ready display. But what I did was "trick" (by lying to) the setup wizard by telling it what it wanted to hear, and NOT what I was actually seeing. And that made everything work nice. But I wasn't expecting to actually see 3D, what I was doing is seeing if it "seemed" to be working in preparation for possibly getting a 3D monitor or TV.

But -- and this is where this story gets very interesting AND makes me very impressed with nvidia.

When I looked at 3D screens -- the first was in nvidia's "3D Vision Photo Viewer" (I think that comes bundled with the 560M driver) -- what nvidia was doing for me was making anaglyphic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anaglyph_image) (high-falootin' word for red/blue - like those comics and cards of years gone by) 3D Stereo images. Then I started FSX & it, too, was making anaghphic images. Whoopie! At that point, all I needed was a pair of red/blue (well, red/cyan to be precise) glasses. Ordered a pair from Amazon, cost about $3.

Yep...it's true. nvidia 3D Stereo Vision actually converts 2D games into 3D games. Gonna have to try other programs that are compatible.

Have had the glasses since I got back from Kripplebush last Saturday and I'm in heaven! Flying the simulator with REAL 3D vision is wonderful, and nvidia appears to do a wonderful job of converting FSX graphics to stereo. Not surprising, really. The concept is trivial (Just make TWO images from the 3D "world" database instead of one.). And it's amazing that, even with red/cyan 3D, the color survives, if subdued.

But none of this is documented in easy-to-find documents. There is no mention that I've been able to find of anaglyphic images. The nvidia driver only really mentions the active type of 3D using IR glasses. Don't know if I discovered a "cheat", an undocumented feature, or what. Must be real, though, since the anaglyphic processing looks very well done & this doesn't seem to be an accident. Next step is to contact nvidia about it and see what they say. My first contact with their customer support was the FIRST time I began to get real insight into what's going on. What I'm unsure of is can I repeat the process by which I got here.

What appears to be happening is that nvidia sees that the TV isn't 3D ready, so it defaults to anaglyphic images rather than active 3D images? Wonder why no mention of this in easy-to-get documentation? Go figure! Makes sense, tho. Anaglyphic images can be shown on any monitor.

Also, reading reviews for active 3D Stereo vision glasses and 3D TV's and monitors has given me the impression that there's a ways to go yet. Lots of comments about ghosting and loss of sync in the active IR glasses technology. Anaglyphic images completely eliminate all that - with the price tag of subdued colors. So I can wait a while for an actual 3D display while the technology matures and prices come down.

So....by now I'm LOVING this Asus G53SX. It's a super speedy machine with lots of wonderful features. AND it's equivalent, processing-power wise with AW machins for 2 grand bucks less. It's always good to get past the stage where I have to housebreak a new computer! It take a LOT more time to clean things up when the computer pees on the floor than it does when a new puppy does it!

Hmmmm....Asus without the "u" is Ass. Now THAT's interesting, too!

[n2ize]

I'll wait for True 3d. Imagine no need for goggles and no limitations of a screen. The 3d image is created by laser in a "fluid" (note, by fluid I mean a gaseous or liquid medium such as aire or water.).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EndNwMBEiVU&feature=player_embedded#!

[W1GUH]

Yea, but it's monochrome. There ARE screens that you can buy today that send different images to each eye without glasses -- one of them Nintendos is one of 'em.

[n2ize]

Yea, but it's monochrome. There ARE screens that you can buy today that send different images to each eye without glasses -- one of them Nintendos is one of 'em.

They claim by using different colour lasers they can create colour displays. I need to find out more about the possibility of doing this in colour. I find this absolutely fascinating because it is true 3d without a screen or illlusionary concept. Indeed it has a way to go in development. I would love to be involved in this project. My whole idea is to eliminate the traditional concept of a "screen".

[W1GUH]

They claim by using different colour lasers they can create colour displays. I need to find out more about the possibility of doing this in colour. I find this absolutely fascinating because it is true 3d without a screen or illlusionary concept. Indeed it has a way to go in development. I would love to be involved in this project. My whole idea is to eliminate the traditional concept of a "screen".

You're right -- a full, vivid color HD hologram would be just amazing! Til then, we're stuck with glasses or special screens.

[n2ize]

It,s interesting what the future may hold. SO many things we have nowaday's that simply were not around 10 or 20 years ago.

[W1GUH]

Dig it! But there's something very satisfying there. Back in college, as we learned digital systems we recognized the potential it held for entertainment. Even talked about recording music on those huge disks they had back in the 60's & 70's. What we didn't anticipate, tho, is the miniaturization that would happen, or the economies of scale that's made all these devices as common as pencils were then.

[W1GUH]

And, btw, Google Earth in 3D is amazing!

[W1GUH]

Just remembered -- you CAN see stereoscopic, 3D images without any extra hardware whatsoever, but it takes a little practice, and maybe not everyone actually can do it. I call it the "going cross-eyed" method.

Put the right-eye image on the left, and the left-eye image on the right, then,while looking at them, go cross-eyed until the two images are merged. You will probably have to tilt you head to get the vertical alignment right. Once the images merge it's not long until you brain sees the merged images as a 3D image and there you have it. There are examples of this over in the creative forum.

There are better and more detailed instructions at this link (http://www.starosta.com/3dshowcase/ihelp.html). The author addressed the eye-strain issue by saying:


Please note that free-viewing stereo pairs can be somewhat stressful. If you feel discomfort in the eyes, you should discontinue, and return to the task later. As you use the technique more frequently, your eye musculature will become accustomed, and eye discomfort will be reduced.

Takes a while to get this all to work right, but once you do, it'll get easier and easier to merge the images and get them focused.

This adds up to the fact that any camera can be a 3D camera for images that don't move. Snap one image....shift the camera "about" the distance between you eyes to the side and snap the other image. Then assemble the images as outlined above. Rotational alignment and spacing isn't nearly as critical as you might think it would be. The precision of "does this look OK in the viewfinder" is usuall plenty good for the rotational alignment, and for "how far to shift?" that's almost completely uncritical. Farther than the spacing between your eyes yields enhanced 3D effect, less and there's less effect. No effect on the ability of the eye's/brain combination to see a stereoscopic image.

So....Viola!!!! 3D imaging without special hardware or glasses. But it's UN-american. It requires the viewer to actively develop a new skill -- something that appears more and more to be anathema to lots of people!

[WØTKX]

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Environment/Pix/columnists/2010/11/3/1288804801798/Hologram-of-Princess-Leia-006.jpg

[W1GUH]

What is that image? Don't recognize what it is or what the illustration is.

[n2ize]

What is that image? Don't recognize what it is or what the illustration is.

I think it was from the original Star Wars. Supposedly in that time and place, they had the technology to generate true screenless 3D images in aire. In our real world that technology may be coming along in the not too distant future.

[n2ize]

So....Viola!!!! 3D imaging without special hardware or glasses. But it's UN-american. It requires the viewer to actively develop a new skill -- something that appears more and more to be anathema to lots of people!

I've done it. It does work to create a 3d-effect. Problem is not everyone can do it, it can get very uncomfortable after a short time, and, it's easy to lose it.

[W1GUH]

After a while, the registration/focus "locks in" and not so easy to lose.