Tehran, we have a problem

[NA4BH]

Maybe they will figure out that outer space is up and not over the horizon (check the picture out). LOL

POOR MONKEY (http://news.yahoo.com/iran-failed-space-monkey-launch-160339378.html)

[NQ6U]

I hope they try again, only using Mahmoud Ahmadinejad as their test subject.

[KG4CGC]

I thought this was about claims that Iran committed an act of war via Mexico.

[NQ6U]

I thought this was about claims that Iran committed an act of war via Mexico.

You mean the car salesman from New Jersey who got caught trying to arrange the assassination of the Saudi ambassador to the U.S.? All I can say is if that amateurish plan really was was implemented through the Iranian intelligence service then we have nothing to fear from them. I'm not convinced it was, though; I think it was more likely a few morans playing at being spies.

Albi, what's your professional opinion?

[kc7jty]

Iran already put a worm in space the article says.

[n2ize]

I hope they try again, only using Mahmoud Ahmadinejad as their test subject.

Ahmadinejad happens to be an intellectual. He is also well educated and happens to be en engineer. He is bitterly hated in the west because he has repeatedly called for the west to respect the sovereignty of the middle east.

[W3MIV]

Ahmadinejad happens to be an intellectual. He is also well educated and happens to be en engineer. He is bitterly hated in the west because he has repeatedly called for the west to respect the sovereignty of the middle east.

Nonsense. Engineers are not educated, well or otherwise, they are trained. Chimpanzees can be trained, but they cannot be educated.

[W5GA]

Nonsense. Engineers are not educated, well or otherwise, they are trained. Chimpanzees can be trained, but they cannot be educated.
Lets put one of your well educated folk and an engineer to designing a transistor, and see who finishes first.

[NQ6U]

Ahmadinejad happens to be an intellectual. He is also well educated and happens to be en engineer.

That figures. There is a statistical connection between an engineering degree and religious fanaticism (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/12/magazine/12FOB-IdeaLab-t.html). There is a disproportional number of engineers among captured terrorists as well. The notorious Shoe Bomber was an engineering student.

EDIT: My bad. It was the Underwear Bomber who was the engineering student, not the Shoe Bomber.

[KC2UGV]

That figures. There is a statistical connection between an engineering degree and religious fanaticism (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/12/magazine/12FOB-IdeaLab-t.html). There is a disproportional number of engineers among captured terrorists as well. The notorious Shoe Bomber was an engineering student.

Engineers seem to think any complex system MUST have been designed... Hence, the correlation.

[W3MIV]

Lets put one of your well educated folk and an engineer to designing a transistor, and see who finishes first.

That's the very attitude that resulted in Frankenstein, Doug, a prescient novel that no engineer would have the lights to create.

[NQ6U]

BTW, it was physicists that came up with the first transistor, not engineers.

[NQ6U]

Engineers seem to think any complex system MUST have been designed... Hence, the correlation.

Their training also makes them look for a simple solution to every problem. That might work within their own discipline but in the real world things are far too messy.

[W3MIV]

That figures. There is a statistical connection between an engineering degree and religious fanaticism (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/12/magazine/12FOB-IdeaLab-t.html). There is a disproportional number of engineers among captured terrorists as well. The notorious Shoe Bomber was an engineering student.

The reason is simple: Engineering is taught virtually as a stand-alone degree program, with very little if any attachment to the humanities. Like most modern business curricula, there is a deep disconnect between the efforts and effects of mere technocrats and the society that will be impacted by their work. I decry today's state of "higher education" because I fervently believe that we should make every effort to understand the potential consequences, the moral as well as the technical impacts of what we are doing before we lift the lid from Pandora's Box.

Only J Robert Oppenheimer (a man later accused of being a commie, humiliated and defrocked) understood what he had helped create when he watched the Trinity test at Alamagordo and whispered, "I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds." Oppenheimer was a wealthy Jew who had been classically educated, a student of literature, before becoming a physicist. Today such pursuits are cast aside as wastes of time in the rush to serve the Korporate Meisters of Amerika.

[W5GA]

BTW, it was physicists that came up with the first transistor, not engineers.
Those same physicists still lack the education that Albi is talking about. They're merely engineers with additional schooling.

[W5GA]

Their training also makes them look for a simple solution to every problem.
After living with military hardware for 20 years, I know this is NOT the case.

[KG4CGC]

Chiming in with the obvious.
Engineers are not researchers or scientists.
They are the applicators of established rules.
For those, such as myself, who shy away from math, become politicians.
Well, that's an extreme point but it is just to help express the message.
I would make a terrible politician.
Question everything.

[n2ize]

The reason is simple: Engineering is taught virtually as a stand-alone degree program, with very little if any attachment to the humanities. Like most modern business curricula, there is a deep disconnect between the efforts and effects of mere technocrats and the society that will be impacted by their work. I decry today's state of "higher education" because I fervently believe that we should make every effort to understand the potential consequences, the moral as well as the technical impacts of what we are doing before we lift the lid from Pandora's Box.

Only J Robert Oppenheimer (a man later accused of being a commie, humiliated and defrocked) understood what he had helped create when he watched the Trinity test at Alamagordo and whispered, "I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds." Oppenheimer was a wealthy Jew who had been classically educated, a student of literature, before becoming a physicist. Today such pursuits are cast aside as wastes of time in the rush to serve the Korporate Meisters of Amerika.

Actually there is a difference between the pure sciences and the tech curricula. Many of the tech schools tend to focus on the tech material at hand, i.e. engineering, computer science, etc. while de-emphasizing the arts and humanities. However, the pure sciences are often taught concurrently with an emphasis on the arts and humanities as well. For instance, when I studied Math as an undergrad I did a Bachelors of the Arts degree and in addition to the math and science courses I was also required to take and devote a great amount of time to the arts. I took a great deal of literature, history, humanities, art, music, and language, and philosophy courses in addition to the core requirements for my major. And the arts/humanities courses I took were not watered down Mickey Mouse versions either. In fact they were quite rigorous, requiring me to devote a great deal of my study time.. It wasn't until I was in graduate school working on my Master of Science degree where the brunt of the emphasis was on the core requirements for my degree. Now I don't know if this is true of all schools but, I tend to find those who studied the "pure sciences" tend to be more closely connected to the liberal arts and tend to be more than just mere technocrats.

Otherwise I would say you are correct. Many of the so called "tech schools" tend to de-emphasise the liberal arts, particularly with regards to business, "high tech", engineering, etc. Of course mileage will vary. There are some schools primarily noted for the technologies who also offer a well rounded curriculum.

[NQ6U]

Those same physicists still lack the education that Albi is talking about. They're merely engineers with additional schooling.

But in the Post-Einstein world, that additional schooling forces them to look at things much differently than an engineer would. When you get down to the sub-atomic quantum level, things really get weird.

[KC2UGV]

Those same physicists still lack the education that Albi is talking about. They're merely engineers with additional schooling.

Physicists (aka Doctorates), have a very thorough education in the philosophies. Liberal arts is the core of all degrees offered where Ph.D.s are granted.

[n2ize]

Physicists (aka Doctorates), have a very thorough education in the philosophies. Liberal arts is the core of all degrees offered where Ph.D.s are granted.

Very true as I alluded to above.

[n2ize]

That figures. There is a statistical connection between an engineering degree and religious fanaticism (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/12/magazine/12FOB-IdeaLab-t.html). There is a disproportional number of engineers among captured terrorists as well. The notorious Shoe Bomber was an engineering student.

EDIT: My bad. It was the Underwear Bomber who was the engineering student, not the Shoe Bomber.

Ahmadinejad is also very well versed in literature, the arts, history, and the humanities. He may be disliked but he is by no means dumb. He is a very intelligent man.

[NQ6U]

Ahmadinejad is also very well versed in literature, the arts, history, and the humanities. He may be disliked but he is by no means dumb. He is a very intelligent man.

I never said he wasn't intelligent, I merely implied that he's a religious fanatic. For good measure, I'd also toss in that he's dishonest and a bad statesman.

[n2ize]

[QUOTE=KJ6BSO;379851]I never said he wasn't intelligent, I merely implied that he's a religious fanatic. For good measure, I'd also toss in that he's dishonest and a bad statesman.

He basically wants the west to stop interfering in the middle east. He seems to be pretty honest in that regard.

[NQ6U]

He basically wants the west to stop interfering in the middle east. He seems to be pretty honest in that regard.

He also basically denies the Holocaust ever happened. He seems to be pretty dishonest in that regard.

[n2ize]

He also basically denies the Holocaust ever happened. He seems to be pretty dishonest in that regard.

But he wants the USA to end unconditional support for Israel and take into account the plight of the Palestinian peoples who have a right to that land. perhaps he is denying the holocaust relative to the holocaust against the Palestinians. And, even if it is true that he is denying the holocaust he is indeed making a valid point regarding the sovereignty of the middle east and the Palestinian peoples.

I am not saying that Ahmahdinejad deserves across the board praise. He may be off base on a lot of things. But, why not listen to the valid points he might be making ?

[NQ6U]

perhaps he is denying the holocaust relative to the holocaust against the Palestinians.

Nope. He just flat out says the whole thing is a lie made up by Jews.

[n2ize]

Nope. He just flat out says the whole thing is a lie made up by Jews.

Okay, so then dismiss that statement. But why not seriously consider some of the valid points he is making ?

[ka4dpo]

Ahmadinejad happens to be an intellectual. He is also well educated and happens to be en engineer. He is bitterly hated in the west because he has repeatedly called for the west to respect the sovereignty of the middle east.

That guy is an idiot. And since when does he respect anyones sovereignty or anything else for that matter. I would love to fit him for a pair of cement shoes.

[NQ6U]

Okay, so then dismiss that statement. But why not seriously consider some of the valid points he is making ?

Oh, I agree that the United States shouldn't be messing around in the middle east and that Israel needs to attend to the Palestinian issue, have since long before Ahmadinejad ever came on the scene. But even if he's correct on those issues, he's still a bigoted, narrow-minded religious fanatic who has no business being the head of state of any modern nation.

[n2ize]

That guy is an idiot. And since when does he respect anyones sovereignty or anything else for that matter. I would love to fit him for a pair of cement shoes.

Who is he killing or attacking ? Seems to me that so far he has respected the sovereignty of other nations. The man is an intellectual.

[suddenseer]

The dissonance created by adhering to a wacky religion while having a working knowledge of the sciences no doubt leads to insanity. The willingness to commit suicide based on belief of same wacky religion may be a result of the insanity.

[W1GUH]

Wow!!! All those types that come in 3D are really flying around the cyber-room.