A Dream that Could Come True

[n2ize]

I had a strange dream last night that I lost my job and for some political/economic reasons I couldn't find any other job. Not even as a wall mart greeter. I ran out of money and tried to move in with my folks but due to the economy they were living in some isolated remote area. As a matter of pride I didn't want to beg friends for food or shelter so I decided to live on the streets. I was in NYC and some homeless guy was showing me the ropes of street life. He was telling me, "this ain't like havin a job and a paycheck and a nice house. You're gonna be freezing in the cold, you're gonna get ripped off, you're gonna have to hustle, you ain't gonna have no TV, no computer, no possessions, and, you're gonna get arrested and serve time in jail every so often... " I awoke thinking of the grim future and thankful it was just a dream.

But ?? Is it just a dream ? Perhaps I was thinking of a future with Bachmann, Perry, Palin, O'Donnagel, and the tea baggers , continued economic erosion and what affect it may someday have on us. Perhaps we may reach that return to medieval feudalism that Bachmann and the tea baggers dream of. Or end up living on the street.
I hope such dreams never come true for anyone. But it is a reminder of how fragile each of our lives are and the circumstances under which we live. The people who run our economy could make these dreams come true.

[WØTKX]

http://youtu.be/RchZkX8j9TA


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RchZkX8j9TA

[KK4AMI]

I had a strange dream last night that I lost my job and for some political/economic reasons I couldn't find any other job. Not even as a wall mart greeter. I ran out of money and tried to move in with my folks but due to the economy they were living in some isolated remote area. As a matter of pride I didn't want to beg friends for food or shelter so I decided to live on the streets. I was in NYC and some homeless guy was showing me the ropes of street life. He was telling me, "this ain't like havin a job and a paycheck and a nice house. You're gonna be freezing in the cold, you're gonna get ripped off, you're gonna have to hustle, you ain't gonna have no TV, no computer, no possessions, and, you're gonna get arrested and serve time in jail every so often... " I awoke thinking of the grim future and thankful it was just a dream.

But ?? Is it just a dream ? Perhaps I was thinking of a future with Bachmann, Perry, Palin, O'Donnagel, and the tea baggers , continued economic erosion and what affect it may someday have on us. Perhaps we may reach that return to medieval feudalism that Bachmann and the tea baggers dream of. Or end up living on the street.
I hope such dreams never come true for anyone. But it is a reminder of how fragile each of our lives are and the circumstances under which we live. The people who run our economy could make these dreams come true.

The only thing I got out of that was, one you would not live with your parents under any circumstances, or two being a New York City feller, you are too proud to live out in the country. Oh and three, you don't mind begging from strangers.

[PA5COR]

Begging for help, the ultimate socialism.
At least we pay in for our social benefits.


:)

[KK4AMI]

Begging for help, the ultimate socialism.
At least we pay in for our social benefits.


:)

To me that is still begging from strangers! Are you saying the only reason we are going through all this is to prevent our populace from suffering embarrassment?

PS- This Thread really needs to be in the "Politics" section.

[WØTKX]

No. Only if you don't suffer because of the rest of humanity.

[N2NH]

AMI:How are things in Maryland?

[PA5COR]

We pay in for unemployment benefit hoiusing benefit and all other perks we have.
That prevents people from thrown out on the street, or being without healthcare etc.
And keep their dignity.
Pays off in the long run, this way is cheaper as over at your place, and is a waste of human resources too.
We provide healthcare for 1/2 the price as in the USA for EVERYONE, no exceptions.

That way people will be a lot happier, we have an unemployment rate of 5.4 % nnow, all unemployed counted.
Compare that to the USA with 19% unemployed.

Since we all pay in, i fail to see the begging part you mention, if i need the social benefits i use up what i paid in, not happened yet.

So it looks like i will not need those benefits and someone else might.
In the end the people stay healthy and well educated, and form a good base for firms hiring people here.
That brings in extra tax for the government and the system pays almost for itsself.



To me that is still begging from strangers! Are you saying the only reason we are going through all this is to prevent our populace from suffering embarrassment?

PS- This Thread really needs to be in the "Politics" section.

[KC2UGV]

To me that is still begging from strangers! Are you saying the only reason we are going through all this is to prevent our populace from suffering embarrassment?

PS- This Thread really needs to be in the "Politics" section.

No, the only reason we are all going through this economic hell, is because the GOP's only goal it to get the black man out of office. Even if it means damnation to the entire country.

[KG4CGC]

Hi John.
You just described one of the Pee Pee Baggers dreams for the future.
Charles Koch is the Antichrist.

[n2ize]

The only thing I got out of that was, one you would not live with your parents under any circumstances, or two being a New York City feller, you are too proud to live out in the country.

I sense that you feel that living in the country is somehow inferior to living in the city ? I've been in both environments and I see pro's and con's to both.


Oh and three, you don't mind begging from strangers.

I think its a matter of survival. I doubt many homeless people enjoy begging from stranger but, unfortunately God created mankind in such a way that h requires food, water, air. Well, air you can still get for free and is everywhere. Water is questionable, depending where you are at a given moment you may have to pay for potable water. Food you almost always have to pay. Oh and a bath or a shower and a clean change of clothes is nice too. Problem is when a person ends up homeless, and they are starving and the survival instinct they will often end up begging from strangers even though they may not want to. I

[n2ize]

To me that is still begging from strangers! Are you saying the only reason we are going through all this is to prevent our populace from suffering embarrassment?

PS- This Thread really needs to be in the "Politics" section.

No, the reason is because economic systems are not flawless and not everyone prospers equally and all the time. It is very easy for a young, dedicated, intelligent, hard working individual to find themselves out of work and facing periods of poverty. Social programs were developed based upon many decades of such experiences. Over time it was learned that it is actually better too have a safety net and various programs in order to help stabilize the individual economically during periods of hardship. If the person can maintain even a very modest standard of living (i.e. basic food, shelter, medical care, clean clothing, etc.) they are more likely to overcome such hardships and remain productive in the long term.

In short what many tea parties call "socialism" (i.e. regulations, taxation, social programs, social security, Unemployment Insurance, Minimum wage, Medicaid, medicare, etc.) is actually the key that enabled a prosperous middle class to thrive and flourish. At the same time business, both large and small, prospered. As we drift away from that path we are actually seeing increased hardship, i.e. rising unemployment, debt, homelessness, austerity, etc. and greater failure rate for business.

[KK4AMI]

AMI:How are things in Maryland?

I don't know Sir, I live in Virginia. Maryland boo hiss!

[KK4AMI]

No, the only reason we are all going through this economic hell, is because the GOP's only goal it to get the black man out of office. Even if it means damnation to the entire country.

Endless Loop, Endless Loop, Endless Loop

[KK4AMI]

We pay in for unemployment benefit hoiusing benefit and all other perks we have.
That prevents people from thrown out on the street, or being without healthcare etc.
And keep their dignity.
Pays off in the long run, this way is cheaper as over at your place, and is a waste of human resources too.
We provide healthcare for 1/2 the price as in the USA for EVERYONE, no exceptions.

That way people will be a lot happier, we have an unemployment rate of 5.4 % nnow, all unemployed counted.
Compare that to the USA with 19% unemployed.

Since we all pay in, i fail to see the begging part you mention, if i need the social benefits i use up what i paid in, not happened yet.

So it looks like i will not need those benefits and someone else might.
In the end the people stay healthy and well educated, and form a good base for firms hiring people here.
That brings in extra tax for the government and the system pays almost for itsself.

I'd see your statistics as being more accurate if you compare the whole EU unemployment rate to the US. Comparing Virginia to Netherlands would seem to be more logical.

[KK4AMI]

No, the reason is because economic systems are not flawless and not everyone prospers equally and all the time. It is very easy for a young, dedicated, intelligent, hard working individual to find themselves out of work and facing periods of poverty. Social programs were developed based upon many decades of such experiences. Over time it was learned that it is actually better too have a safety net and various programs in order to help stabilize the individual economically during periods of hardship. If the person can maintain even a very modest standard of living (i.e. basic food, shelter, medical care, clean clothing, etc.) they are more likely to overcome such hardships and remain productive in the long term.

In short what many tea parties call "socialism" (i.e. regulations, taxation, social programs, social security, Unemployment Insurance, Minimum wage, Medicaid, medicare, etc.) is actually the key that enabled a prosperous middle class to thrive and flourish. At the same time business, both large and small, prospered. As we drift away from that path we are actually seeing increased hardship, i.e. rising unemployment, debt, homelessness, austerity, etc. and greater failure rate for business.

OK, you used the "young intelligent couple" as your example, what about this guy?

He has two degrees, but went on disability back in the 80s! Now he is bitching because he is 74 years old, he's cold, living in Maine, divorced twice? I say this man put himself in his untenable position. With two degrees, he could have gotten a job sitting on his ass with the State or Federal Government, disability or not. Believe me I know, I've done it. As I see it, he built his own gallows. Gawd, at least he could have moved to Florida and saved money on heat!

He says,"I don't drink, I don't smoke, I don't chew and I don't go with girls that do," Ricker said. "In other words, on that $1030 income you don't do very much outside the home." After finishing high school in 1956, Ricker earned an associate degree in electronics engineering and went to work selling and repairing marine electronics. He later earned a theology degree and served as a pastor at churches in New Hampshire and Vermont. But times were hard on a pastor's salary, so he returned to Maine, eventually becoming a cameraman and studio engineer for a TV station.

After being laid off in the 1980s, he was hired to do some carpentry for an inn. His first day on the job, the floorboards gave way.
With his injuries, he could no longer tend to the three-unit apartment house he and his wife owned. They sold it, bought a used trailer for $7,000 and settled on a lot in Hartford, a town of about 1,000 people. Ricker and his second wife, Judith Odyssey, divorced around 1995 and she moved out. But he offered to let her move back in nine years ago when she was going through a rough time, and she now lives in the other end of the trailer. She gets $674 a month in Social Security.

Besides his back and shoulder injuries, Ricker has diabetes, eye and breathing problems, and his hands shake. Odyssey has congestive heart problems, asthma and arthritis. It's hard to make ends meet. Rent for the lot is $150 a month; Ricker has to buy insurance and gas for his minivan and pay bills for electricity and a phone. He shops at a discount grocery store, gets canned goods from a food pantry, scours garage sales for clothes. It cost $3,200 last winter to heat the poorly insulated trailer with kerosene, which was partially offset with about $1,000 in heating assistance funds. Inside the trailer, ceiling tiles are coming loose and electrical wires dangle in the bathroom where a light fixture once hung. An old dryer, a mattress, a snow blower, discarded chairs and other junk are strewn about outside.

Still, Ricker keeps his sense of humor.

[NQ6U]

Endless Loop, Endless Loop, Endless Loop

Yeah, I know, and I wish you fucking teabaggers would shut up about it. It's always the same old thing: "class warfare," lower taxes for the wealthy, making sure Obama is a one-term president over and over and over again.

[KK4AMI]

Yeah, I know, and I wish you fucking teabaggers would shut up about it. It's always the same old thing: "class warfare," lower taxes for the wealthy, making sure Obama is a one-term president over and over and over again.

Well then you should love me, my wife is a Republican, so I don't f@#K teabaggers, I want to hold taxes not lower them, I want Obama to win so that we get more teabaggers in the Senate, finally I'm too lazy to do anything over and over again! :)

[n2ize]

OK, you used the "young intelligent couple" as your example, what about this guy?

He has two degrees, but went on disability back in the 80s! Now he is bitching because he is 74 years old, he's cold, living in Maine, divorced twice? I say this man put himself in his untenable position. With two degrees, he could have gotten a job sitting on his ass with the State or Federal Government, disability or not. Believe me I know, I've done it. As I see it, he built his own gallows. Gawd, at least he could have moved to Florida and saved money on heat!

He says,"I don't drink, I don't smoke, I don't chew and I don't go with girls that do," Ricker said. "In other words, on that $1030 income you don't do very much outside the home." After finishing high school in 1956, Ricker earned an associate degree in electronics engineering and went to work selling and repairing marine electronics. He later earned a theology degree and served as a pastor at churches in New Hampshire and Vermont. But times were hard on a pastor's salary, so he returned to Maine, eventually becoming a cameraman and studio engineer for a TV station.

After being laid off in the 1980s, he was hired to do some carpentry for an inn. His first day on the job, the floorboards gave way.
With his injuries, he could no longer tend to the three-unit apartment house he and his wife owned. They sold it, bought a used trailer for $7,000 and settled on a lot in Hartford, a town of about 1,000 people. Ricker and his second wife, Judith Odyssey, divorced around 1995 and she moved out. But he offered to let her move back in nine years ago when she was going through a rough time, and she now lives in the other end of the trailer. She gets $674 a month in Social Security.

Besides his back and shoulder injuries, Ricker has diabetes, eye and breathing problems, and his hands shake. Odyssey has congestive heart problems, asthma and arthritis. It's hard to make ends meet. Rent for the lot is $150 a month; Ricker has to buy insurance and gas for his minivan and pay bills for electricity and a phone. He shops at a discount grocery store, gets canned goods from a food pantry, scours garage sales for clothes. It cost $3,200 last winter to heat the poorly insulated trailer with kerosene, which was partially offset with about $1,000 in heating assistance funds. Inside the trailer, ceiling tiles are coming loose and electrical wires dangle in the bathroom where a light fixture once hung. An old dryer, a mattress, a snow blower, discarded chairs and other junk are strewn about outside.

Still, Ricker keeps his sense of humor.

What is the relevance of this ? This is one single individual and not necessarily a reflection upon thousands of others who meet with poverty at one time or another throughout their lives. While he doesn't sound like he was the most ambitious person around it does sound like he at least tried to keep busy on an assortment of jobs over the years until he met with misfortune, disability and now illness.

[n2ize]

Well then you should love me, my wife is a Republican, so I don't f@#K teabaggers, I want to hold taxes not lower them, I want Obama to win so that we get more teabaggers in the Senate, finally I'm too lazy to do anything over and over again! :)

For what logical reason would you want more Teabaggers in the senate ? Are you that deeply opposed to progress and a robust middle class ? Or do you feel that increased austerity is the true path to economic success and a vibrant future ? Do you really believe that by empowering special interests and crippling the ability of government to bargain on behalf of the working man and the poor man will somehow make the country a better place ?

[KG4CGC]

What I'd like to know is, when has any society ever benefited from deep austerity? The poor and middle class have had to claw for their rights.

[X-Rated]

For what logical reason would you want more Teabaggers in the senate ? Are you that deeply opposed to progress and a robust middle class ? Or do you feel that increased austerity is the true path to economic success and a vibrant future ? Do you really believe that by empowering special interests and crippling the ability of government to bargain on behalf of the working man and the poor man will somehow make the country a better place ?

I think he really feels that the country will be stronger by shooting itself in the foot and rebuilding as Germany did.

[KG4CGC]

I think he really feels that the country will be stronger by shooting itself in the foot and rebuilding as Germany did.But doesn't that mean more of that ebil socialism that the GOTea decries as, "Satanic?"

[KK4AMI]

What is the relevance of this ? This is one single individual and not necessarily a reflection upon thousands of others who meet with poverty at one time or another throughout their lives. While he doesn't sound like he was the most ambitious person around it does sound like he at least tried to keep busy on an assortment of jobs over the years until he met with misfortune, disability and now illness.

Just wanted to show the other side of the coin, you always show the "good Disney type" unemployed people. We are one screwed up country. We have "handicapped" people fighting for and winning equal pay and rights in the work place. Then we have "disabled" people fighting to get more pay and out of the work force?

[KK4AMI]

For what logical reason would you want more Teabaggers in the senate ? Are you that deeply opposed to progress and a robust middle class ? Or do you feel that increased austerity is the true path to economic success and a vibrant future ? Do you really believe that by empowering special interests and crippling the ability of government to bargain on behalf of the working man and the poor man will somehow make the country a better place ?

I see no progress coming. I see nothing but confusion, debt and dysfunction. The way I see it the United States cannot afford its people. I'm choosing to push the "Reset Button". I am willing to undergo austerity measures if its necessary. I see no way this 14 + Trillion dollar debt goes away. I'll be raising "Cornish Crosses, Hunting and Gardening! ;)

[X-Rated]

Just wanted to show the other side of the coin, you always show the "good Disney type" unemployed people. We are one screwed up country. We have "handicapped" people fighting for and winning equal pay and rights in the work place. Then we have "disabled" people fighting to get more pay and out of the work force?

http://www.desmogblog.com/sites/beta.desmogblog.com/files/blogimages/teabaggers_1.jpg

But enough about Teabaggers.

[X-Rated]

I see no progress coming. I see nothing but confusion, debt and dysfunction. The way I see it the United States cannot afford its people. I'm choosing to push the "Reset Button". I am willing to undergo austerity measures if its necessary. I see no way this 14 + Trillion dollar debt goes away.

What are you willing to do to make it go away?

[KK4AMI]

What are you willing to do to make it go away?

Well, as a for instance, my wife and I are both entitled to a full social security check because we both worked 30+ years. I could accept getting cut to one check as long as we are a family.

[KG4CGC]

I remember an ultraconservative morning DJ, who in 2008 said, that he wanted another depression, BECAUSE HE COULD AFFORD IT.
KK4AMI, can you afford it? I'm assuming that you think it's a good way to cull off more of the undesirables in society.

DJ, Russ Cassell, WORD 1330 AM.

[X-Rated]

Well, as a for instance, my wife and I are both entitled to a full social security check because we both worked 30+ years. I could accept getting cut to one check as long as we are a family.

Drawing SS won't make a deficit "go away". I was curious as to what your reply would be since the $14T in part is due to people like you who have already drawn so much from the Treasury.

[KK4AMI]

Drawing SS won't make a deficit "go away". I was curious as to what your reply would be since the $14T in part is due to people like you who have already drawn so much from the Treasury.

I only addressed one idea. Since my wife and I put so much in to the Treasury, I consider that a wash.

[X-Rated]

I only addressed one idea. Since my wife and I put so much in to the Treasury, I consider that a wash.

Cough cough. What a laugh. That's what all of the Guvmint teat suckers say.

[n2ize]

I see no progress coming. I see nothing but confusion, debt and dysfunction. The way I see it the United States cannot afford its people. I'm choosing to push the "Reset Button". I am willing to undergo austerity measures if its necessary. I see no way this 14 + Trillion dollar debt goes away. I'll be raising "Cornish Crosses, Hunting and Gardening! ;)

Hate to have to say it but that attitude is just plain dumb. So you'd rather hang yourself for the rich man and special interests ?

[KK4AMI]

Cough cough. What a laugh. That's what all of the Guvmint teat suckers say.

I'll trust you have enough experience in that area to know what your talking about.

[NQ6U]

Well then you should love me, my wife is a Republican, so I don't f@#K teabaggers, I want to hold taxes not lower them, I want Obama to win so that we get more teabaggers in the Senate, finally I'm too lazy to do anything over and over again! :)

Heh heh heh, cute.

Unfortunately, cute don't cut it, even though that's what you always do when someone seriously challenges you. I must assume it's a protection mechanism you retreat to whenever you realize you can't argue from an rational point of view. That does not surprise me since the whole Teabag movement is designed by it's creators (the Koch Brothers, aided and abetted by Rupert Murdoch) to play on the emotions of the intellectually challenged and is almost entirely devoid of fact.

[KK4AMI]

Hate to have to say it but that attitude is just plain dumb. So you'd rather hang yourself for the rich man and special interests ?

There are around 4 million people that have over a million dollars in assets that I would call rich. There are around 200 million that have less then me and want what I have. You tell me who is most likely to steal from me. Special Interests (NRA, ARRL) yes.

[KK4AMI]

Heh heh heh, cute.

Unfortunately, cute don't cut it, even though that's what you always do when someone seriously challenges you. I must assume it's a protection mechanism you retreat to whenever you realize you can't argue from an rational point of view. That does not surprise me since the whole Teabag movement is designed by it's creators (the Koch Brothers, aided and abetted by Rupert Murdoch) to play on the emotions of the intellectually challenged and is almost entirely devoid of fact.

I tend to get cute when I have to confront bigotry.

[KG4CGC]

There are around 200 million that have less then me and want what I have.
Straight from the TP list of bullet points and it's total hogwash.

[X-Rated]

I'll trust you have enough experience in that area to know what your talking about.

Being in the private sector, yes, I do see enough of your kind out there.

[NQ6U]

I tend to get cute when I have to confront bigotry.

So, to you, bigotry=challenging your views? Pretty pathetic, Station.

[KK4AMI]

So, to you, bigotry=challenging your views? Pretty pathetic, Station.

No, but belittling somebody for their beliefs is.

[NQ6U]

No, but belittling somebody for their beliefs is.

When did I belittle you for your beliefs? Let me answer that: I didn't. I belittled you for your inability to support your point of view and because I suspect that it isn't really your point of view, just something that you've fallen for because it seems appealing to your sensibilities.

But, to be fair, I'll let you have a go at explaining your "beliefs" in your own words. That means no use of Tea Party or GOP talking points. If I can Google any significant phrase in your explanation and find it verbatim elsewhere on the Web, you lose.

[KC2UGV]

Endless Loop, Endless Loop, Endless Loop

True, as long as the GOP keeps their "number one job is making sure Obama is a single term president" (Mitch McConnell), then yes, our economy will never recover as long as the GOP is keeping our nation as a halt.

[KC2UGV]

There are around 4 million people that have over a million dollars in assets that I would call rich. There are around 200 million that have less then me and want what I have. You tell me who is most likely to steal from me. Special Interests (NRA, ARRL) yes.

The people who have more than you, because they feel you are a slave, and nothing but a drain on the economy.

It's been going on for about 35 years or so.

[WØTKX]

I've always found it interesting when someone labels themselves as "belittled".

Now, here's a quote from the Great Philosopher of the Tea Party True Believers.


Upper classes are a nation's past; the middle class is its future.
~ Ayn Rand

Weird, huh?

[n2ize]

There are around 4 million people that have over a million dollars in assets that I would call rich. There are around 200 million that have less then me and want what I have. You tell me who is most likely to steal from me. .

The 4 million that you would call rich. You see unfortunately you are misled to believe that just because some people have less than you they want what you have, they don;t want to work, and they want a free handout. But that is not the case.

[NQ6U]

I've always found it interesting when someone labels themselves as "belittled".

He's just playing the victim, a standard ploy right out of the GOP/Tebagger playbook. I guess he had no choice since being cute didn't work.

[WØTKX]

http://m.polls.newsvine.com/servista/imagesizer?file=krishna109DE643B93-73E0-D761-00C2-3AF50AE77287.jpg&width=nws