View Full Version : Negative Feedback
I just got accused of being a nasty person. Oh well.
The message I got reads as follows:
BOY YOUR A NASTY PERSON.
YOU DID NOT EVEN GIVE ME A CHANCE TO CORRECT THE PROBLEM.
I DON'T SEE HOW THE BOX WAS DAMAGED AND I SENT OUT 5 OTHERS AND NO PROBLEMS.THE UNIT WAS WELL PACKED AND SHOULD HAVE ARRIVED JUST FINE.
HOW ELSE COULD YOU SHIP FOR ONLY 5.OO
WELL IT WAS NOT NICE LEAVE NEGATIVE FEEDBACK WITHOUT CONTACTING MEBad grammar and shouts a lot too, doesn't he.
Now, here's the backstory...
A couple of days ago, there was a post on the Ameco AC-1 reflector about a small quantity of vintage Ameco Multi-Meters that were being offered for sale on eBay. So I went & looked. $10 each + $5 S/H. Reasonable, and a nice little item to go alongside my AC-1, so what the heck, I went ahead and ordered one.
It came on Friday. Placed inside a USPS priority mail envelope -- not a box, a letter envelope. No packing material of any kind; no newspaper, shredded paper, bubble wrap, nothing. And as might be expected, the envelope had been crushed under unknown weight, so the meter box itself was also crushed.
At least Ameco used bubble wrap & syrofoam to protect the meter. It looks OK. But still...
So, I left less than positive feedback. What else can I do? Get in a pissing match over a $15 meter because the seller either underestimated the shipping (not my fault) or was careless (ditto)? Not worth the aggravation. What's he going to do to "fix" the problem, anyway... uncrush the box? Give me the shipping back if I remove the feedback? (That's blackmail, and I won't have any parts of it... )
Oh, I did answer him back and pointed out the lack of proper packaging, and the fact that if he underestimated the cost of shipping, that's not my fault.
Needless to say, I don't think this gentleman is going to want my business in the future.
w3bny
09-06-2011, 01:54 PM
You complain too much....No star for you!
It sounds like he did a crappy job of packing, no doubt about it, but did you give him a chance to make good on it before you left feedback?
It sounds like he did a crappy job of packing, no doubt about it, but did you give him a chance to make good on it before you left feedback?Do what? He only had a few and sold them all, so what could he have done, uncrushed the box?
NA4BH
09-06-2011, 02:07 PM
Maybe he could've refunded your money?
Maybe he could've refunded your money?Then I would have been obligated to return the meter. Although I would have properly packed it, I would have still lost on the deal (it would have cost me more to send it back than his charge, in other words).
You complain too much....No star for you!Just for that, come over for a vist. My dog loves chasing bunnehs... :evil:
X-Rated
09-06-2011, 02:53 PM
I just got accused of being a nasty person. Oh well.
The message I got reads as follows:Bad grammar and shouts a lot too, doesn't he.
Now, here's the backstory...
A couple of days ago, there was a post on the Ameco AC-1 reflector about a small quantity of vintage Ameco Multi-Meters that were being offered for sale on eBay. So I went & looked. $10 each + $5 S/H. Reasonable, and a nice little item to go alongside my AC-1, so what the heck, I went ahead and ordered one.
It came on Friday. Placed inside a USPS priority mail envelope -- not a box, a letter envelope. No packing material of any kind; no newspaper, shredded paper, bubble wrap, nothing. And as might be expected, the envelope had been crushed under unknown weight, so the meter box itself was also crushed.
At least Ameco used bubble wrap & syrofoam to protect the meter. It looks OK. But still...
So, I left less than positive feedback. What else can I do? Get in a pissing match over a $15 meter because the seller either underestimated the shipping (not my fault) or was careless (ditto)? Not worth the aggravation. What's he going to do to "fix" the problem, anyway... uncrush the box? Give me the shipping back if I remove the feedback? (That's blackmail, and I won't have any parts of it... )
Oh, I did answer him back and pointed out the lack of proper packaging, and the fact that if he underestimated the cost of shipping, that's not my fault.
Needless to say, I don't think this gentleman is going to want my business in the future.
Sorry to say, but I looked in your dissertation here and did not see where you were purchasing a box. It looked like you were purchasing a meter. "...vintage Ameco Multi-Meters that were being offered for sale on eBay. So I went & looked. $10 each + $5 S/H. Reasonable..." Then you write, "At least Ameco used bubble wrap & syrofoam to protect the meter. It looks OK."
No foul here.
Sorry to say, but I looked in your dissertation here and did not see where you were purchasing a box. It looked like you were purchasing a meter. "...vintage Ameco Multi-Meters that were being offered for sale on eBay. So I went & looked. $10 each + $5 S/H. Reasonable..." Then you write, "At least Ameco used bubble wrap & syrofoam to protect the meter. It looks OK."
No foul here.Hmmm. OK, let me clarify:
The original eBay ad simply listed the item as a "NOS" Ameco multimeter. It was still in the original Ameco box, as packed by them, with instructions and probles. I should have specifically stated that, and not left it implied that the meter purchase included more than just the meter itself.
To put this in perspective... let's say you were buying, oh, a hand microphone advertised as "new old stock" (if not in those exact terms) unopened. You wouldn't anticipate that you'd open the shipping container to find just a mike, you'd expect to find the mike in the manufacturer's plastic or box or styrofoam or whatever they originally put it in... but you'd just refer to it as a mike, right?
In any case... the bubble wrap & styrofoam mentioned, to be precise, were wrapped around the meter etc., and the entire set of material was inside the original Ameco cardboard box. THAT box is the one that was placed (with full contents) inside the envelope. Clear now?
Incidently, I've heard back from the seller, who blames the post office for the package being compressed, but admits that he could have packed it better (besides just putting it in an envelope with no padding, or bubble wrap, or etc.)
WØTKX
09-06-2011, 03:42 PM
Oooooh, that's nasty!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D763aWigu_0
X-Rated
09-06-2011, 03:54 PM
Hmmm. OK, let me clarify:
The original eBay ad simply listed the item as a "NOS" Ameco multimeter. It was still in the original Ameco box, as packed by them, with instructions and probles. I should have specifically stated that, and not left it implied that the meter purchase included more than just the meter itself.
To put this in perspective... let's say you were buying, oh, a hand microphone advertised as "new old stock" (if not in those exact terms) unopened. You wouldn't anticipate that you'd open the shipping container to find just a mike, you'd expect to find the mike in the manufacturer's plastic or box or styrofoam or whatever they originally put it in... but you'd just refer to it as a mike, right?
In any case... the bubble wrap & styrofoam mentioned, to be precise, were wrapped around the meter etc., and the entire set of material was inside the original Ameco cardboard box. THAT box is the one that was placed (with full contents) inside the envelope. Clear now?
Incidently, I've heard back from the seller, who blames the post office for the package being compressed, but admits that he could have packed it better (besides just putting it in an envelope with no padding, or bubble wrap, or etc.)
Yeah yeah. Nonetheless, buyers need to provide the opportunity to get the seller to make things right. Perhaps he would give you all your money back plus shipping charges and gasoline money to the moon. You won't know now. Plus studious sellers can spot potential buyers who post frivolous negative feedback and can block your future bids. That is what I do.
If someone wants to block me from bidding, because I objected to poor shipping practices, then that's probably someone I wouldn't want to buy from anyway.
So what are you saying? I should withdraw my feedback because I didn't ask the buyer to undo something that could not be undone?
NA4BH
09-06-2011, 06:30 PM
It's like the time my wife sold a biology lab book for one of the kids, it looked brand new and had no marks on it. She sold it, shipped it, and all was fine. Until the buyer noticed that one diagram page was missing. Totally embarrassed, the wife told the buyer to expect a full refund and keep the book for the inconvenience with her deepest apologies. You never know what the seller will do until you tell them about the problem.
There's an RV dealer that does the bulk of his business on FleaBay in Arizona. One of his stipulations for the winning bidder is that they post POSITIVE feedback on their dealings with the dealer, in the seller's presence, then the dealer supposedly password-locks the feedback so it can't be changed later.
W2NAP
09-07-2011, 12:23 AM
ebay sucks and needs to die
ebay sucks and needs to die
As far as ham radio equipment goes it sure does and I wish that whole section would be majickly eliminated in favor of local hamfest flea markets.
For other things, it's maybe not so bad. My wife gets great deals on the stuff she need for her little jewelry hobby/part-time-for-extra-income job buying directly from the same foreign suppliers where the local retailers buy theirs. It saves her a ton of money and allows her to give her clients a better deal while still making a decent profit. It would be a lot harder for her to compete if she had to pay full retail for the stuff.
W3MIV
09-07-2011, 06:06 AM
ebay sucks and needs to die
Ain't gonna happen. Ebay is fantastically successful, and they now own both PayPal and Bill-Me-Later, riveting their place in the hierarchy of internet players. More proof of the dictum that "nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public."
X-Rated
09-07-2011, 09:21 AM
If someone wants to block me from bidding, because I objected to poor shipping practices, then that's probably someone I wouldn't want to buy from anyway.
So what are you saying? I should withdraw my feedback because I didn't ask the buyer to undo something that could not be undone?
I don't think you can withdraw your negative feedback. But if the seller offers or can offer to refund all monies, there is no foul. I tried to find the listing on ebay and could not, but like I said earlier, the box wasn't even important enough for you to mention in the description of what you were buying, so it seemed to me you were looking for a reason to ding someone with a negative feedback.
I hold back and give negative feedbacks on deals where there is no effort to make things right. But you have to live with your actions. I don't.
Just what is so hard about packaging something to ensure its safe arrival?
Oh, that's right...packaging material costs money. Silly me.
X-Rated
09-07-2011, 11:02 AM
Just what is so hard about packaging something to ensure its safe arrival?
Oh, that's right...packaging material costs money. Silly me.
Like I said, from the OP, the meter did achieve a safe arrival. If Ron didn't like what he received, he had the option to ask for his money back. Silly me. I thought that some people considered a reputation something to revere, but I forget that some do not.
In an email reply earlier today, the seller admitted that he should have packed the package more carefully.
I'm not going to, shall we say, discuss what gender or body parts hair follicles came from based on their thickness, let alone whether or not, or how, they should be split. The package as shipped was not packaged carefully, the overall contents showed damage. It is only pure luck that the damage was contained only to the outer parts of the package.
And that, as they say, is the bottom line.
X-Rated
09-07-2011, 12:53 PM
In an email reply earlier today, the seller admitted that he should have packed the package more carefully.
I'm not going to, shall we say, discuss what gender or body parts hair follicles came from based on their thickness, let alone whether or not, or how, they should be split. The package as shipped was not packaged carefully, the overall contents showed damage. It is only pure luck that the damage was contained only to the outer parts of the package.
And that, as they say, is the bottom line.
Well, the bottom line is that you put your reputation out there as well. Many people read those feedbacks and the fact that you left a negative without giving the seller a chance to make it right speaks volumes.
Had the seller been here, I could have complained to them about not packing the product properly. But as a friend, I was responding to you to give advice. But I try to block bidders who I see have given negative feedback and there is no effort to let the seller correct it. It is a crucial point that has to be stepped through. You call it "splitting hairs" but it is what it is. Hate me for reality is being what it is. It really don't matter to me.
BEFORE the debate:
W3WN
At least Ameco used bubble wrap & syrofoam to protect the meter. It looks OK.
AFTER the debate:
W3WN
...the overall contents showed damage.
BEFORE the debate:
W3WN
.................
LATER in the debate:
W3WN
The original eBay ad simply listed the item as a "NOS" Ameco multimeter. It was still in the original Ameco box, as packed by them, with instructions and probles. I should have specifically stated that, and not left it implied that the meter purchase included more than just the meter itself.
Your arguments fall apart and the story changes. But none of this matters since you had not allowed the seller to make things right. It does put you on a slippery slope.
OK. Fine. I give up. Next time, if there is a next time, I will go into the gory, boring details so that there is no seeming discrepancies. Hopefully this will not happen.
The seller left me positive feedback right after receiving payment, which I was not aware of (I hadn't paid much attention to it), and yes, it appears that the feedback can not be altered or added to. Nevertheless, should there be a next time, I will contact the seller to see what can be done. If anything.
Just so that you understand a mitigating circumstance... a few months back I purchased a Twoer (for parts, although it was not advertised as such, just as needing some work) and the seller basically threw it in a box with insufficient material to prevent it from bouncing around. When I opened the box, there were loose bits & pieces, the front panel mounted controls were smashed in, and it was generally in poorer shape than I expected as a result. The seller would not consider taking the item back, and took no other action. AFTER I posted negative feedback, he threatened to do the same if I didn't remove it. (If he did, I never saw it.)
I am not including every last detail here obviously, but the broad strokes should give you an idea that I am not thrilled about someone, anyone, who charges a fee for shipping & handling (and let's face it, especially on smaller items, I think that's where a lot of sellers really make their money, especially since eBay doesn't take a cut off the S&H price) and then skimps on either or both. As I said before, I'd rather pay the extra buck or three and get the item properly (or at least better) protected.
Maybe I'm risking a ding on my reputation. So be it. I'd rather, to be blunt, be an jackass when it comes to demanding this stuff gets packed properly. And if it's a question of a buck, tell me upfront... it's usually worth it to pay the extra buck. We've all read (or can find if we look) horror stories about UPS, FedEx, USPS and the others denying insurance payments on damage because of claims (legit or not) that the damaged package wasn't packed properly.
OTOH, I received that rig from Charles yesterday. Radio wrapped in bubble wrap, inside a box just the right side, and THAT box also wrapped in more protective shipping material inside the actual shipping box. Outside box had a small tear in it... it happens (fortunately nothing penetrating, and I don't think I even bothered to mention it to him when I confirmed delivery). But the radio, and the other contents, were safe & sound. I'm sure it took him extra time to do it... it sure looked like it. Was it worth it? You betcha.
WØTKX
09-07-2011, 01:39 PM
Yes, Charles knows how to ship properly. As do I.
KG4CGC
09-07-2011, 01:42 PM
I will over package any item being shipped except for obvious things that cannot be damaged from flattening and throwing.
I want the item to arrive in the same condition that it left. We have part of a room dedicated to to shipping supplies, packaging materials and etc.
X-Rated
09-07-2011, 01:49 PM
...
Just so that you understand a mitigating circumstance... a few months back I purchased a Twoer (for parts, although it was not advertised as such, just as needing some work) and the seller basically threw it in a box with insufficient material to prevent it from bouncing around. When I opened the box, there were loose bits & pieces, the front panel mounted controls were smashed in, and it was generally in poorer shape than I expected as a result. The seller would not consider taking the item back, and took no other action. AFTER I posted negative feedback, he threatened to do the same if I didn't remove it. (If he did, I never saw it.)...
Sellers have not had the option to leave negative feedback to buyers for over 3 years now. Knowledge is power. I was just trying to help you out. You can tell me the story about how your mother gave you chicken noodle soup one time when you were sick and it does not change the fact that proper etiquette on ebay calls for the buyer to contact the seller for a remedy before leaving negative feedback on the seller. I really wish it worked that way though.
K7SGJ
09-07-2011, 06:21 PM
As of a few months ago, those EBAY bastads did start taking around 10% of the S&H charges. They are trying to force sellers to do free shipping, which sucks. How the F do you offer free shipping across the country for free? At a bare minimum, our shipping averages about 6-8 bucks per item. Actual shipping charges via USPS through Ebay, no less. Between their listing fees, Paypal fees, pay later BS, S&H fees, and all the other Bullshit, it's hard for a seller to make a buck. And, a buyer can fuck a seller every which way to stupid, and sellers have very little recourse. Sellers can no longer honestly rate a negative transaction which is even more bullshit. Being more of a seller than a buyer, I would appreciate knowing who the deadbeats are. I sure wish Ebay had some decent competition, maybe some changes would be made. But being about the only game in town, and Ebay and Paypal changing policies almost monthly, you either put up with it, or quit them altogether. For us, it is a necessary evil since we buy and sell to augment our incomes.
X-Rated
09-08-2011, 09:07 AM
<Crickets> Chirp. Chirp. Chirp.
KC2SIS
09-08-2011, 09:27 AM
He outright poorly packaged the item and took his chances that it would arrive ok. My pop's bought a GAP vertical a few years ago and despite everything being properly packaged the bottom section of the antenna was very noticeably bent. It must have been crushed by something pretty darn heavy as this was the thickest part of the antenna.
I wouldn't even bother with this guy anymore if he is emailing you, ignore him as he got what he deserved for doing a lousy job on the S&H part of the deal.
W1GUH
09-08-2011, 11:07 AM
In an email reply earlier today, the seller admitted that he should have packed the package more carefully.
I'm not going to, shall we say, discuss what gender or body parts hair follicles came from based on their thickness, let alone whether or not, or how, they should be split. The package as shipped was not packaged carefully, the overall contents showed damage. It is only pure luck that the damage was contained only to the outer parts of the package.
And that, as they say, is the bottom line.
"I feel your pain."
First of all, IMHO, bad packing is bad packing and needs bad feedback regardless (oooo...tempted to put "ir" in front of that -- :evil:) of whether or not he had the opporunity to "make good" or not. I think you were absolutely right to post about the packaging -- that's something the potential buyers really need to know.
That whiney yell from that thin-skinned idiot that you quoted reminds me of something that happened a few years ago. I ordered a CD and when it came it played just fine but it was filthy. I looked like somebody burned it in their dusty attic and made sure to leave as many fingerprints on it as humanly possible. I emailed the party I ordered it from and said that it plays fine and I love it -- then tried (constructively -- really) to point out that she might consider handling the CD's a little more carefully and to not ship such a dirty CD. She responeded with, (from memory)
WELL, IF YOU HATE IT SO MUCH SEND IT BACK AND I'LL SEND YOUR MONEY BACK.
Whew!!!! Sure wish that such thin-skinned people would get their act together.
X-Rated
09-08-2011, 12:45 PM
I don't think anyone said the seller should not be dinged in some manner for poor shipping. You are arguing a lost cause.
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