The Top Ten Violence Inducing Prescription Drugs.

[N2NH]

I had a boss who took Prozac and can tell you from experience it's a life changer alright. The list (as per TIME magazine) here. (http://www.NaturalNews.com/031017_violence_prescription_drugs.html)


NaturalNews) The Institute for Safe Medication Practices (ISMP) recently published a study in the journalPLoS Onehighlighting the worst prescription drug offenders that cause patients to become violent. Among the top-ten most dangerous are the antidepressants Pristiq (desvenlafaxine), Paxil (paroxetine) and Prozac (fluoxetine).

Concerns about the extreme negative side effects of many popular antidepressant and antipsychotic drugs have been on the rise, as these drugs not only cause severe health problems to users, but also pose a significant threat to society. The ISMP report indicates that, according to the U.S. Food and Drug Administration's (FDA) Adverse Event Reporting System, many popular drugs are linked even to homicides.

Most of the drugs in the top ten most dangerous are antidepressants, but also included are an insomnia medication, an attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) drug, a malaria drug and an anti-smoking medication.

Learn more:http://www.NaturalNews.com/031017_violence_prescription_drugs.html#ixzz1UGpQl hbY

[suddenseer]

I take a diabetic pill (metformin), and a proton pump inhibitor (protonix), and a blood pressure med (lisonipril) I guess I am safe around children. I used to take 7 pills a day, after switching to a vegan diet, I am down to 3. I hope to be rid of these by years end.

[N8YX]

So much for roid rage. All the side effects with none of the benefits... :wall:

[KG4CGC]

I took Pristiq for 2 months. I determined that it was simply worthless snake oil. It did absolutely nothing. When Prozac was all the rage, I was able to determine through raw testing that it was made up of analogous substances to cocaine and heroin. It was a speedball for the masses.
Had a friend who took Paxil for a few days. It made him dumber than a box of rocks, ornerier than a mule and as giggly as a school girl.
Your Mileage May Vary.

[n2ize]

And on the flip side some of these medications are highly beneficial in helping some patients to function normally. I have a friend who had such severe depression, anxiety, and, phobia disorder that he could hardly leave his house, let alone lead a normal, functional life. It wasn't until he was given Paxil that he was able to function like a human being again without suffering from the horrid, nightmarish, anxiety attacks.

[n2ize]

I took Pristiq for 2 months. I determined that it was simply worthless snake oil. It did absolutely nothing. When Prozac was all the rage, I was able to determine through raw testing that it was made up of analogous substances to cocaine and heroin. It was a speedball for the masses.
Had a friend who took Paxil for a few days. It made him dumber than a box of rocks, ornerier than a mule and as giggly as a school girl.
Your Mileage May Vary.

Actually Prozac has little if anything in common with cocaine and heroin chemically or pharmacologicaly. It may make some people seem as if they night be intoxicated with either of the two drugs but it is actually very different. Prozac is a serotonin reuptake inhibitor.

neither Prozac or Paxil are particularly safe IMHO but, they are invaluable to people suffering from serious anxiety disorder and panic attacks.

[KG4CGC]

Actually Prozac has little if anything in common with cocaine and heroin chemically or pharmacologicaly. It may make some people seem as if they night be intoxicated with either of the two drugs but it is actually very different. Prozac is a serotonin reuptake inhibitor.

neither Prozac or Paxil are particularly safe IMHO but, they are invaluable to people suffering from serious anxiety disorder and panic attacks.Yes John, most all those drugs are serotonin reuptake inhibitors.
Please go do your research and look at the molecular models. There are key similarities between the molecules of coke and smack and a Prozac capsule. Look it up. You will be astonished.

ETA: Don't forget to look at the strength of the bonds between molecules. Nearly identical.

[n6hcm]

two of those drugs are relatively new on the market (pristiq, chantix) ...

at least three are no longer best-practices sorts of meds (halcion, paxil, prozac). these are rarely prescribed early in therapy anymore.

lariam is known to have problematic side effects. since it isn't widely prescribed it is very much a risks vs. benefits kind of decision.

selecting the right SSRI for the right patient is more of an art than a science.

is this a casual association with violence? which other chemicals were involved?

[n6hcm]

oh ... here's the full list from the primary source: http://www.plosone.org/article/showImageLarge.action?uri=info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fj ournal.pone.0015337.t001

[n2ize]

Yes John, most all those drugs are serotonin reuptake inhibitors.

Do you have a reference to this. To my knowledge they are not. Nor could I find any quick references describing morphine and cocaine as SRI's. And right now I don't have the time to delve into the Pharmacopeaa.


Please go do your research and look at the molecular models. There are key similarities between the molecules of coke and smack and a Prozac capsule. Look it up. You will be astonished.

It's been a long time since I have studied Organic Chemistry, I see some similarities but I also see very significant differences in the molecular structures. And all it takes is a few small structural differences to dramatically alter the psychological and physical effects of a chemical. Just look at the differences between heroin and cocaine alone. One is a depressant the other a stimulant. One binds to opioid receptors where it mimics endorphines the other does not.
From personal experiences I can tell you there is a significant difference between them.
SSRI's however I have never tried and I don't intend to either.

[kb2vxa]

I feel depressed, I feel so bad
But you're the best pill that I ever had
I can't get your love, I can't get a fraction
Uh-oh, little pill, psychotic reaction
(shouted) And it feels like this!

I can't seem to face up to the facts
I'm tense and nervous and I
Can't relax
I can't sleep 'cause my bed's on fire
Don't touch me I'm a real live wire

Psycho Killer
Qu'est-ce que c'est
fa fa fa fa fa fa fa fa fa far better
Run run run run run run run away
Psycho Killer
Qu'est-ce que c'est
fa fa fa fa fa fa fa fa fa far better
Run run run run run run run away

One pill makes you larger
And one pill makes you small
And the ones that mother gives you
Don't do anything at all
Go ask Alice
When she's ten feet tall

Well, you get the idea...................

[KG4CGC]

@John:

I said that Prozac is a speedball not an SSRI. I said most all of those drugs are SSRI, not all.

[n2ize]

@John:

I said that Prozac is a speedball not an SSRI. I said most all of those drugs are SSRI, not all.

"Speedball" is a slang term for a mixture of heroin and cocaine either mixed or used concomitantly. It has also been used in days gone by for mixtures of stimulants and depressants, i.e. amphetamines and barbiturates, speed and librium or valium, etc.

Prozac is a "Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor" because it targets specific serotonin sites and doesn't allow reuptake to occur thus causing a buildup of serotonin in the brain which is supposed to help alleviate symptoms such as depression, anxiety disorder, panic attacks, etc.

Cocaine doesn't act this way. Cocaine is a CNS stimulant and can even cause panic attacks in certain people. It is not a SSRI. I believe it affect dopamine receptors and it can also cause the brain to produce more opiate receptors thus making opiates less effective over time. Unlike cocaine heroin is a CNS depressant. it binds to specific opiate receptors. Neither of these 2 drugs is an SSRI as they do not selectively target serotonin receptors. Of course cocaine is also a local anesthetic. Anyone who has ever tried using it via the nasal route has probably noticed that it eventually numbs the back of the nose and the two upper front teeth. And it can work wonders for a bad toothache. Heck it should be legal just for that purpose. :-D

However I am interested as to whether either of these 2 drugs, opiates and cocaine, do inhibit serotonin reuptake to some small or moderate degree. Unfortunately I cannot find any studies or descriptions that say that they do. I was hoping you might be able to point me to something.

On the other hand Prozac is most definitely an SSRI. It was specifically designed to be an SSRI.

[KG4CGC]

John, you always have a way of clouding every damn issue someone tries to discuss with you. Look beyond what you read in a book or look up on wiki and consider what is actually happening to a person who takes Prozac.
You couldn't possibly understand what I'm talking about because you will not even accept it as a possibility.

[n2ize]

John, you always have a way of clouding every damn issue someone tries to discuss with you. Look beyond what you read in a book or look up on wiki and consider what is actually happening to a person who takes Prozac.
You couldn't possibly understand what I'm talking about because you will not even accept it as a possibility.

When a person takes Prozac the serotinin receptors in their brain are blocked from re-uptake causing a buildup of serotonin in the brain which is supposed to reduce depression and anxiety. Cocaine and heroin work differently and have different effect, Persons whom I know who have taken Prozac do not get the same kind of CNS depression and euphoria that heroin produces because Prozac and heroin work differently inside the brain. Heroin is metabolized into morphine which , unlike Prozac then binds to opiate receptors where it mimics natural endorphines. The essential mechanisms regarding heroin, cocaine and Prozac are well known to science.

You stated that Heroin, cocaine and Prozac are all "selective serotonin uptake receptors" (SSRI's) and I am saying that I cannot ascertain that fact from any of the pharmacological literature that I presently have at my disposal. Nor can I ascertain that based on effects because all three of the drugs in question (two of which I have used in my lifetime) have very significant differences in terms of formula, and physical and psychological effects i.e. the way they make you feel thus indicating that all three act upon the brain and CNS differently. These facts correlate with pharmaceutical science. All I would appreciate is if you can point me to a piece of pharmacological literature that indicates they all act as SSRI's and/or cause some degree of serotonin reuptake inhibition because I cannot find anything so far.

And sorry, when it comes to such thin gs as the mechanisms behind how drugs work in the brain I like to base things on scientific research as opposed to assumption. perhaps that makes me ignorant or stupid and perhaps I am a very stupid man. If so,, then so be it. My ignorance and stupidity and my reliance on science has managed to work well for me so I'll stick with it and remain stupid.

[KG4CGC]

You stated that Heroin, cocaine and Prozac are all "selective serotonin uptake receptors" Wrong. Never said that.
Please pay attention to the main point. Prozac contains a molecular make up of one or more substances that are analogous to cocaine and heroin.


(SSRI's) and I am saying that I cannot ascertain that fact from any of the pharmacological literature that I presently have at my disposal. No pharmaceutical company in their right might mind would ever admit to any similarities.


have very significant differences in terms of formula, and physical and psychological effects i.e. the way they make you feel thus indicating that all three act upon the brain and CNS differently. These facts correlate with pharmaceutical science. See above.


All I would appreciate is if you can point me to a piece of pharmacological literature that indicates they all act as SSRI's and/or cause some degree of serotonin reuptake inhibition because I cannot find anything so far.There is no scientific study to say so. See above. You must break the capsule open yourself and subject it to your own personal testing. The effects of a speedball are not as profound but are a speedball none the less.


And sorry, when it comes to such thin gs as the mechanisms behind how drugs work in the brain I like to base things on scientific research as opposed to assumption. perhaps that makes me ignorant or stupid and perhaps I am a very stupid man. If so,, then so be it. My ignorance and stupidity and my reliance on science has managed to work well for me so I'll stick with it and remain stupid. Now you're just getting personal. You want to argue the point as if we were in a courtroom but I'm saying that the side effects brought on by Prozac are part of its molecular analogous nature to two popular illegal drugs and again, no big pharma company will ever admit that.

Most of these SSRIs over do what they are supposed to do. Basically, drug companies are just guessing and trying to see what works best. The other side effects of raised blood pressure and other heart conditions should start to raise a few questions about CNS stimulation.

Pristiq is another one with dual effects.
serotonin-norepinephrine reuptake inhibitors (http://anxiety.emedtv.com/anxiety/serotonin-norepinephrine-reuptake-inhibitors.html), or SNRIs (http://anxiety.emedtv.com/serotonin-norepinephrine-reuptake-inhibitor-%28snris%29/snris.html) for short. SNRIs act on specific chemicals within the brain known as serotonin and norepinephrine. These are two of several chemicals used to send messages from one nerve cell to another.
Norepinephrine is a known chemical in the brain that gets excited by people who ingest speed and or coke. This is a drug that was developed with former stimulant abusers in mind but, it doesn't really correct the chemical transfer in the synapses to a pre-abuse time in the person taking the drug, Pristiq. Targeting serotonin and other such related brain chemicals will soon fall out of favor, but not until the drug companies have exploited this path for as long as possible. Afterall, we're talking 1980's science that has since been proven to be ineffective for most people seeking relief from some sort of ill feelings. Yes, it works for a few people but like other drugs in the past, they are being over prescribed.

Balancing the way your blood handles oxygen and the oxygen levels in your brain will prove more fruitful in treating common ''depression'' in the future but until then, they drug companies will stay on the lucrative road they're on.

[N2NH]

Well Ritalin is prescribed to 6 million Americans and it is similar to Cocaine. That much is fact.

As far as Prozac and Coke:


Earlier generations of serotonin-targeting drugs like cocaine, amphetamines, diet pills, and Ecstasy “have been exhaustively studied in animals, and all have been shown to be neurotoxic to cells in the brain—for example, destroying nerve endings. But there’s very little comparable research on the SSRIs,” Glenmullen says. “To do animal research, you need tiny doses of the pure drug. Yet researchers say that each pharmaceutical company controls the supply of pure drug while it is under patent. To do studies under a company’s auspices means signing a contract that allows it to veto publication unilaterally.”

SCIENCE! LINK (http://harvardmagazine.com/2000/05/the-downsides-of-prozac.html)

I'm quite certain nobody was well aware of that. :bs: Crafty bugger.

[KG4CGC]

Well Ritalin is prescribed to 6 million Americans and it is similar to Cocaine. That much is fact.
It's a great buzz too.

[N2NH]

It's a great buzz too.

Now, now Charles, that isn't the scientific term is it? :lol:

It's gives a great feeling of enthusiasm/euphoria. Just sayin, ya know. The way they say it north of here.http://i414.photobucket.com/albums/pp221/The_Missourian/Flags/smiley_sleepcampfire.gif

[n2ize]

Wrong. Never said that.
Please pay attention to the main point. Prozac contains a molecular make up of one or more substances that are analogous to cocaine and heroin.

No pharmaceutical company in their right might mind would ever admit to any similarities.


In organic chemistry many drugs and compounds have structural similarities between each other. There are various benzine rings in different configurations, methyl groups, acetyl groups. matter of fact many drugs belon to the same classes of compounds, i.e. esters, alcohols, etc. However, just because similar structures exists within different molecules does not mean they act the same way when places in the blood stream or when they cross the blood brain barrier. Minor changes can radically alter the manner in which a given druigs reacts.




There is no scientific study to say so. See above. You must break the capsule open yourself and subject it to your own personal testing. The effects of a speedball are not as profound but are a speedball none the less.

Again "speedball" is a slang term. A "speedball" effect is a combined effect. You get a stimulating jag from the stimulant drug in the speedball and you get the smoothed out mellowness of the depressant. it's actually a pretty cool high, i used to dig it years ago. it is also dangerous because the cocaine constricts your blood vessels requiring increased heart output but the depressant is slowing the heart making the chances of a heart attack more likely. However, just because some people may seem to get a "speedball" effect when they use Prozac in certain ways.



Now you're just getting personal. You want to argue the point as if we were in a courtroom but I'm saying that the side effects brought on by Prozac are part of its molecular analogous nature to two popular illegal drugs and again, no big pharma company will ever admit that.

They don't have to admit it. Any organic chemistry student can look up the formulas and structural models for prozac, heroin and cocaine and they will see that there are various common organic components present in each of these drugs. At the same time the student will also see that these common organic structures are arranged quite differently in each of the three drugsnand will realize they probably exert different effects. Cocaine and heroin both have benzine rings yet one is a stimulant and one a depressant Morphine for example has -OH radicals attached and so does alcohol. Yet they work differently.



Most of these SSRIs over do what they are supposed to do. Basically, drug companies are just guessing and trying to see what works best. The other side effects of raised blood pressure and other heart conditions should start to raise a few questions about CNS stimulation.

All drugs have varying side effects. Just because a drug may cause CNS stimulation does not automatically make it like cocaine. Certain antibiotics can give false positives for opiates. But that doesn't mean there is opium in them. NSAID's can increase blood pressure a d cause anxieties. But that doesn't mean they are speed. Allergy medicines can cause sleepiness but that doesn't mean they work like morphine in the brain.



Pristiq is another one with dual effects.
Norepinephrine is a known chemical in the brain that gets excited by people who ingest speed and or coke. This is a drug that was developed with former stimulant abusers in mind but, it doesn't really correct the chemical transfer in the synapses to a pre-abuse time in the person taking the drug, Pristiq. Targeting serotonin and other such related brain chemicals will soon fall out of favor, but not until the drug companies have exploited this path for as long as possible. Afterall, we're talking 1980's science that has since been proven to be ineffective for most people seeking relief from some sort of ill feelings. Yes, it works for a few people but like other drugs in the past, they are being over prescribed.

Actually many of these compounds have been proved very effective. Many people with depression and severe panic disorders can now live normal lives because of these drugs. Where they were once confined to the home and living in constant fear of an attack they can now hold jobs, go out with friends, and live normal lives. The same holds true for many antipsychotic medicines. True they may have unpleasant side effects but many people taking them can live relatively normal lives where as at one time they would have been confined to a sanitarium in a vegitative state does up on Haldol or Thorazine.

Pharmaceutical research is an ongoing developmental process involving various disciplines such as biological-psychology (understanding the bio-chemical nature of brain functions and disorders),and many other specialties. As the research evolves there is no doubt that new drugs may be developed, perhaps improved versions of SSRI's or maybe entirely hew drugs that work on different parts of the brain with fewer side effects.

In any event it;s an ongoing process. It's not just a haphazard, guesswork and "shot in the dark" process. It is a gradual and painstaking evolutionary type of research that involves countess hours of research, experimentation, more research, experimentation, testing, etc.

As a person who worked in the Pharmaceuticaal industry I can tell you. Although I wasn't a drugmaker I did learn that a heck of a lot of intense and dedicated research and hard work and intensive testing goes into every pill that ends up dispensed at the pharmacy. it is by no means a crapshoot. There is a heck of a lot of expertise behind the scenes.



Balancing the way your blood handles oxygen and the oxygen levels in your brain will prove more fruitful in treating common ''depression'' in the future but until then, they drug companies will stay on the lucrative road they're on.

Perhaps this will be true. Time will tell.

[W1GUH]

Yes, but all those drugs are highly beneficial to the patent holders' profits. Doesn't really matter what it does to the people actually using them. It's good for the GDP, so deal with it!

[KG4CGC]

They do what they do. You should know that. What I'm seeing is not a considered discussion but a 1st year lab class argument that the prof already knows the outcome to.
You know, we could argue for a month of Sundays on what the book says vs what happens in the real world. Argument, is also a stimulant that triggers a positive or "rewarded response" in the brain.

[n2ize]

Yes, but all those drugs are highly beneficial to the patent holders' profits. Doesn't really matter what it does to the people actually using them. It's good for the GDP, so deal with it!

So, are you going to tell people with panic disorder who can now live functional lives that these drugs are of no benefoit and are just sold to make people rich and they should just go back to the old days when the only cure for their misery was some clueless doctor saying "just get over it" ? I have a good friend who suffered with severe panic disorder from when he was 16 years old well into his mid-late 30's or early 40's.. He couldn't travel anywhere, he couldn't ride a train, a bus, a plane, he couldn't drive or evan walk to many places, he even had to avoid talking about or thinking about certain topics for fear it would trigger a severe panic attack. And even when he did all these things he still got severe attacks which would leave him dysfunctional for days and severely depressed for weeks thereafter. His young and young adult life was literally hell on earth. .

Then one day a drug called Paxil came on the market and his doctors felt that it showed promise. So they prescribed it to him. It took a few weeks to reach full benefit butt now he can lead a relatively normal life. He can function, he can go places, do things and live like a human being. He is no longer living in a "hell on earth". yes, he still gets anxiety now and then but, when he does it is very mild and passes quickly.

Its easy for us to dismiss these drugs as useless ploys or placebos just to make rich people richer, especially when we know little about what went into their development and especially when we are feeling normal and are not suffering from anxiety or depression. But they do actually help people. Lots of people. people who once could not function and who were miserable every day who can now get through their days without having to endure constant misery.

[n2ize]

They do what they do. You should know that. What I'm seeing is not a considered discussion but a 1st year lab class argument that the prof already knows the outcome to.
You know, we could argue for a month of Sundays on what the book says vs what happens in the real world. Argument, is also a stimulant that triggers a positive or "rewarded response" in the brain.

Well, to have a meaningful productive discussion on this topic you first enroll in a University and get an advanced degree in Pharmaceutical Research or Medicine. then after years of hard study and research you get a position working in the field and you discuss it in depth with your colleagues. I have found that the 'real" discussions on topics happen when like minded people who are expert in the same profession get together to discuss a particular topic in which they are expert professional. Anything less is just unproductive drivel.

When i hear a group of professionals discussing what they are best qualified in it is music to my ears.

Think about it like this. Who would you rather hear discussing crime in Gotham City ? Experts like The Penguin, The Riddler, Catwoman,and The Joker or, a bunch of wannabee amateur punks ?

[KG4CGC]

Non sequitur ............. ↑
I guess you are qualified then? That's what I'm getting.
Say what you want, real world results and experiences from the real world people who have actually taken the drugs. Results trump what paid technicians put down on paper. The results the researchers are after look good on paper but are not repeatable enough in the real world to prove that a drug does what it's supposed to do, as it is marketed, 100% of the time.
This is what you wish everyone would ignore.
If it gives you another buzz hit, please keep it going. I honestly think that's what you're really after. You tend to feel a need to poop on everything that counters what you have read or been told. I've seen you do this hundreds of times now. I feel like I'm the token bait liberal on a FOX opinion show and am being used to promote some irrational agenda.

Done.

You can have the last word.

[W1GUH]

[QUOTE=n2ize;364801]So, are you going to tell people with panic disorder who can now live functional lives that these drugs are of no benefoit and are just sold to make people rich and they should just go back to the old days when the only cure for their misery was some clueless doctor saying "just get over it" ? I have a good friend who suffered with severe panic disorder from when he was 16 years old well into his mid-late 30's or early 40's.. He couldn't travel anywhere, he couldn't ride a train, a bus, a plane, he couldn't drive or evan walk to many places, he even had to avoid talking about or thinking about certain topics for fear it would trigger a severe panic attack. And even when he did all these things he still got severe attacks which would leave him dysfunctional for days and severely depressed for weeks thereafter. His young and young adult life was literally hell on earth. .

Then one day a drug called Paxil came on the market and his doctors felt that it showed promise. So they prescribed it to him. It took a few weeks to reach full benefit butt now he can lead a relatively normal life. He can function, he can go places, do things and live like a human being. He is no longer living in a "hell on earth". yes, he still gets anxiety now and then but, when he does it is very mild and passes quickly.

Its easy for us to dismiss these drugs as useless ploys or placebos just to make rich people richer, especially when we know little about what went into their development and especially when we are feeling normal and are not suffering from anxiety or depression. But they do actually help people. Lots of people. people who once could not function and who were miserable every day who can now get through their days without having to endure constant misery.[/QUOTE

Oh, hell no!!! EVERYBODY should take these drugs because it's good for the economy! That's all.

[n2ize]

So, are you going to tell people with panic disorder who can now live functional lives that these drugs are of no benefoit and are just sold to make people rich and they should just go back to the old days when the only cure for their misery was some clueless doctor saying "just get over it" ? I have a good friend who suffered with severe panic disorder from when he was 16 years old well into his mid-late 30's or early 40's.. He couldn't travel anywhere, he couldn't ride a train, a bus, a plane, he couldn't drive or evan walk to many places, he even had to avoid talking about or thinking about certain topics for fear it would trigger a severe panic attack. And even when he did all these things he still got severe attacks which would leave him dysfunctional for days and severely depressed for weeks thereafter. His young and young adult life was literally hell on earth. .

Then one day a drug called Paxil came on the market and his doctors felt that it showed promise. So they prescribed it to him. It took a few weeks to reach full benefit butt now he can lead a relatively normal life. He can function, he can go places, do things and live like a human being. He is no longer living in a "hell on earth". yes, he still gets anxiety now and then but, when he does it is very mild and passes quickly.

Its easy for us to dismiss these drugs as useless ploys or placebos just to make rich people richer, especially when we know little about what went into their development and especially when we are feeling normal and are not suffering from anxiety or depression. But they do actually help people. Lots of people. people who once could not function and who were miserable every day who can now get through their days without having to endure constant misery.

Oh, hell no!!! EVERYBODY should take these drugs because it's good for the economy! That's all.

I don't get your point ? Why should everybody take them ? I don't take them. Most people I know don't take them. I only know one person who takes them and that was the person i described.. Just because they were developed by a corporation does that make them bad ? Would it be better if we didn't develop drugs and just let people suffer ? Or are you saying everyone should take them regardless of whether we need them or not.

Maybe I am going crazy or I just don't understand. is there a middle ground of reason anymore or is everything a black and white roller coaster going from dark to light and light to dark ? Maybe its the heat. Hopefully cooler weather will get here soon.

[n2ize]

Non sequitur ............. ↑
I guess you are qualified then? That's what I'm getting.
Say what you want, real world results and experiences from the real world people who have actually taken the drugs. Results trump what paid technicians put down on paper. The results the researchers are after look good on paper but are not repeatable enough in the real world to prove that a drug does what it's supposed to do, as it is marketed, 100% of the time.
This is what you wish everyone would ignore.
If it gives you another buzz hit, please keep it going. I honestly think that's what you're really after. You tend to feel a need to poop on everything that counters what you have read or been told. I've seen you do this hundreds of times now. I feel like I'm the token bait liberal on a FOX opinion show and am being used to promote some irrational agenda.

Done.

You can have the last word.

What I guess I am trying to say is that a drug is either a serotonin re-uptake inhibitor or it isn't. And only science can tell us that. for certain. I thought you might have known some scientific literature that might explain that. I figured maybe it would be interesting. But it doesn't matter, its not all that important anyway.

As far as the rest goes, people are generally subjective and will believe what they want to as opposed to what really is. I see it happen al the time, from the right, left, and center. That is why I generally turn to science, logic, research, and people with expertise before I draw conclusions. I may have a hunch or feel a certain way about something and I might be right but I can't know for sure or conclude I am until I have viable data.

I feel like I am on a FOX show too when I am told I am short sighted, or stupid, because I expect tangible evidence before I accept something as probable fact. i