Need Advice on New HF Rig

[N2NH]

I've been without one since last summer and miss it a lot. I'm looking for a replacement All Mode HF rig hopefully with 2M/70cm also. Something compact that can also be used portable or in a car. I'm replacing a Yaesu FT-857 and an FT-817. I've heard good things about the Icom IC-7000 too.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.:yes:

[NQ6U]

The IC-7000 is a very nice radio. It probably has the best receiver of any of those compact all-mode rigs. Of course, there will be a learning curve since Icom radios use a different menu system than Yaesu.

[KJ3N]

IC-7000. I own 2. Nuff said.

[N9FE]

You will regret buying a 7000. Now you'll get those who love them. But i will give more than ten people's calls that sent the back a week after owning one. The 7000 is icoms problem child. But spend your money as you wish.

[KJ3N]

You will regret buying a 7000.

Unlikely, IMO.


Now you'll get those who love them. But i will give more than ten people's calls that sent the back a week after owning one. The 7000 is icoms problem child. But spend your money as you wish.

And Yaesu has had its share as well. The 950 and 2000 were dogs when they came out. It took them almost 3 years to get the problems ironed out.

Early adopters get to QC any new radio. The rest of us tend to wait a bit to see how things work out. ;)

BTW, what are the reasons the 7000s were returned? Actual failures, or personal dislikes? There are people out there that simply don't like XYZ brand radios. I'm like that. I won't touch a Yaesu HF radio for love or money. Don't like the way they are laid out and how they operate. YMMV

[N8YX]

Go for broke - get a TS-2000X or an IC-9100. Maybe an Elecraft K3 with transverters. Or a used FT-847.

[N9FE]

K0CWO Sent back to icom three times. Hot audio, Grounding RF issues. Sold radio. W9RMA Sent back to icom twice display and rf issues. Sold radio. N9KCO After one week of trying to get Rf issues resolved, Sold radio. WG0G. Sent back to icom 4 times, Grounding, display, And RF issues. Told icom to keep it and send money back. Went back to 706. W9MMS Worked with icom for over a month. Could not get RF out of receive. Sold radio. You want me to go on i will. There are many more. These guys have given icom every chance, Only to be very disapointed. Once again. Its your money. Spend as you wish.

[N8YX]

I found the following while searching for "IC-7000 failures":

http://sv8ym.blogspot.com/2010/07/latest-developments-on-ic-7000.html

This condition may or may not be present in all late-model '7000s or in any other late-model Icom HF transceivers...but IIRC, some of the guys were carping about their Pro-IIIs and '7800s blowing the PA drivers. Possibly certain runs of the '706 as well.

[KJ3N]

K0CWO Sent back to icom three times. Hot audio, Grounding RF issues. Sold radio. W9RMA Sent back to icom twice display and rf issues. Sold radio. N9KCO After one week of trying to get Rf issues resolved, Sold radio. WG0G. Sent back to icom 4 times, Grounding, display, And RF issues. Told icom to keep it and send money back. Went back to 706. W9MMS Worked with icom for over a month. Could not get RF out of receive. Sold radio. You want me to go on i will. There are many more. These guys have given icom every chance, Only to be very disapointed. Once again. Its your money. Spend as you wish.

RF in receive? WTF is that? Never heard of that one. I've used one mobile and one in the shack. Never heard of RF in the receive.

RF in the TX audio I've heard of, but that can happen with almost any radio, depending on installation. Many people didn't bother to use the grounding screw that came with the remote cable on both the 706 and the 7000. Forgetting that screw tended to manifest itself as RFI issues, especially on 20m.

Grounding issues inside the 7000 leading to PA failure I've heard of, but external grounding issues are very installation specific. The internal grounding issues (to my knowledge) were addressed a year or 2 ago.

Obviously, these guys had problems, but as someone who has used a 7000 mobile for the better part of 3.5 years, I have never experienced any RFI issues. I've used the other 7000 for over 2 years as a backup rig in the shack. Never a RFI issue there, even when using the AL80B. They just keep on working.

:dunno:

[N6YG]

Go for broke - get a TS-2000X or an IC-9100. Maybe an Elecraft K3 with transverters. Or a used FT-847.

Elecraft has a new K3 coming out that looks really promising. I'm not really fond of the K3 interface but could get used to it as a mobile or portable rig.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbtyRyEEADo

I've used my share of radios and I have to say I really like icom's user interface. Of course that alone would never prevent me from owning a Yaesu or Kenwood as I have owned those as well.

While they are both nice rigs the IC-7000 is in a completely different league then the FT-857. I've had both and they are what they are. I would chose the FT-857 if money was an issue or if I needed a very small rig. I would chose the 7000 if money or theft was not as much a concern and an FT-847 if I wanted superb VHF/UHF performance

I own an FT-847 all I have to say is that you would have to pry it out of my dead hands because while it might not be one of the best HF rigs around it is one of the best VHF/UHF weak signal rigs ever built. My primary station is a Pro-3 for HF and an FT-847 for VHF/UHF and backup HF. I have an FT-857 for mobile and when I finally get another sailboat it will either have an IC-7000 or a K3X at the Nav station.

Again don't forget to take a look at the new K3X http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbtyRyEEADo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbtyRyEEADo)

[PA5COR]

Owning 2 FT847's Collins/Inrad filters, one new bought 12 years back, one latest batch 2005, as spare.
Turned on at 09.00 or about, turned off at 03.00 every day, the old one still in use till it drops apart.
Had 9 trips to France in the van with it, so it travelled 25K miles and operated in difficult circumstances.
Replaced the on/off switch once.

FT 100 ( no D) Collins filters including 6 KHz AM filter, did al mods myself, never let me down.
All radio's 160 - 70 cm all mode

FT 847's ( get a 2004/2005 model) cheap as chips now 2nd hand, get the inrad filters, and you're set.

[N6YG]

Owning 2 FT847's Collins/Inrad filters, one new bought 12 years back, one latest batch 2005, as spare.
Turned on at 09.00 or about, turned off at 03.00 every day, the old one still in use till it drops apart.
Had 9 trips to France in the van with it, so it travelled 25K miles and operated in difficult circumstances.
Replaced the on/off switch once.

FT 100 ( no D) Collins filters including 6 KHz AM filter, did al mods myself, never let me down.
All radio's 160 - 70 cm all mode

FT 847's ( get a 2004/2005 model) cheap as chips now 2nd hand, get the inrad filters, and you're set.

I really have to agree, The FT-847 is a great little rig, I've never had a lick of trouble with mine and it's been used almost daily for the last 8 years or so. Be forewarned that for any serious HF work the optional filters are almost mandatory. If you're only a casual HF user rag chewer and not into contesting then you very well might be happy with the stock filters. Heck I used the stock filters for close to 5 years before upgrading.

As far as price is concerned they seem to be holding their value quite well. When the TS-2000 was released the FT-847 took a hit as people dumped them in favor of the newer TS-2000. Unfortunately the love affair with the TS-2000 wasn't long lived and former FT-847 users started selling off TS-2000's and buying up used FT-847 which drove the price sky high. Not that there's anything wrong with the TS-2000 It's just that the FT-847 seems to perform better on VHF/UHF. I've watched used FT-847 prices drop to as low as $700 and then within a few years skyrocket to $1400 for a loaded one in mint condition. Today they vary in price between $900 and $1200.

[PA5COR]

Prices here are between 800 - 950 Euros.
Bought my first one when they came out with Collins filters for 6500 Guilders ( guilder - dollar was then 1 G for 3.50 Dollar so about 1900 dollars or so, full price.....

My second one i bought from a shop, never used in closed box for 900 Euro's, since the shop closed doors.
Added Inrad filters, thinking about adding the roofing filter from Inrad to the new one, that wil make it a good HF rig.

With Collins filters it already performs nice, and i know it is not a FT 9000 or Ft 5000, but then with my antenna's it works fine all over the world.
Even the FT 100 has a decent reciever for such small box, better as the Ft 857/897 that followed it up.

And i worked with quite a lot of other transceivers in my time ;)
Better spend more money on antenna's.

[N2NH]

Thanks to all who replied. I do miss the FT-857 I had, but I was never really thrilled with the menu system. You expect that on the FT-817 as it was a very small rig, but not on an everyday radio. I'm going to do some comparison shopping on the FT-847 and a few other radios. If the 847 is half as good as what it's users think, it's got to be a keeper. I like Elecraft, but they are a bit high on price.

[N7YA]

Ive heard nothing but raves for the K3, i am seriously considering that one when i finally retire my 1983 model FT-757gx.

That fact alone also has anything with "FT" in its name as a serious contender for a new rig.


By the way...love the sigline pic you have there. :agree:

[W5GA]

Be forewarned that for any serious HF work the optional filters are almost mandatory. If you're only a casual HF user rag chewer and not into contesting then you very well might be happy with the stock filters. Heck I used the stock filters for close to 5 years before upgrading.
For serious HF work, none of the rigs mentioned so far has a receiver sufficient for the game, particularly the low band stuff. By serious, I'm including monster pileups, contesting etc. One trip through CQWW with the ability to do A/B with an 847, 2000 or so class rig and something with an adequate rx (TT Omni-6, FT-1000...even go back as far as a TS-930 or IC-751/761) will leave you in wonder...as in you'll wonder why you didn't make the switch before now.

[NQ6U]

The FT-847 was a fine radio but it was never intended to be a serious HF rig. The idea was to build an excellent VHF/UHF rig with "good-enough" HF capabilities, and that's what it is. I'd love to have one for 2m weak signal and (eventually) satellite work but even my old IC-736 has a better HF receiver.

[N1LAF]

IC-7000. I own 2. Nuff said.

What Jim said.

I have both the 7000 and the 706MKIIG, both are outstanding radios, not one problem. Had the 7000 for a few years - nice radio.

[W2NAP]

Thanks to all who replied. I do miss the FT-857 I had, but I was never really thrilled with the menu system. You expect that on the FT-817 as it was a very small rig, but not on an everyday radio. I'm going to do some comparison shopping on the FT-847 and a few other radios. If the 847 is half as good as what it's users think, it's got to be a keeper. I like Elecraft, but they are a bit high on price.

i hate menu driven radios. menu driven radios must die.

i hear lots say the 847 is really a good rig. not the best on HF but it will work.

[PA5COR]

From N0AZZ review:
After I received it I found the HF was not bad at all and decided to make it my backup rig for HF also. My main rig is a FTDX-5000MP and the FT-847 doesn't have a bad receiver either.
Certainly not if you use good Xfilters.
No, it's not the K3, the price you pay is also diiferent.
But for me it's the swiss knife for 160 - 70 cm.
And the results on H.F. are excellent, performance of my antenna system is more important for me as the most glitzy transceiver in the shack, also having the most used functions directly on the front panel and not in a hidden menu is a pre.
Using the EQplus with MD-1 Yaesu mike always gets me unsolicited excellent audio reports.

It drives the Heathkit SB-1000 restaurated 1 KW linear with 35 to 65 watts for 500 - 1000 watts out with the 3-500ZG tube.

Learn to use the attenuator, and RF gain...
Some have said the HF performance is not good.
That is a far from the truth.
Most operators have never learnt to turn their RF gain down.
My FT 847 mods:
Kuhne xtal oven to keep the master oscillator very stable.
Temperature controlled fans, LM 317, one resistor, one variable pot, one NTC resistor and a few C's, all it takes.
Not necessary, but done anyway, changes in L.F. audio path to get more low.
Added 22 NF C to FM modulation circuit, more natural low in FM
Replaced stock filters for a combo Collins/Inrad 2.4 KHz filters.
Replaced the band filter switching diodes by low noise Schottky diodes. ( BAT 85)
Removed 1 C in the P.A, output on 70 MHz now 90 watts, ready for when the band will be available here soon, that also drops the current on 50 MHz, checked output on all bands with spectrum analyser and no changes in spurious signals.
After replacing the power switch, modding it to use both switching contacts, adding a 15 Ohm resistor in line to limit switching current through the contacts and add C over the contacts to quench the sparking, never failed on me again, the original switches are hard to get, but the same type can be found in the old mouse used on computers as switches for left/right click, computer on/off switches etc and are cheap as chips, but a real daunting task to replace.
Changed R's at the phones outlet, so that audio from the speaker and headphone is the same, modded volume pot so that the "JUMP" at the start at low volume is gone.
If you use the FT 847 a lot, clean the fans and compartments every year from dust, check fans.
Replaced the 1 cm 4x4 cm fan on the back with a 2 cm 4x4 cm fan.
Replaced the PL 259 antenna receptacle for 2 meter to N, 2/70 is all N connectors here and Ecoflex 15 1/2 inch cable.
Cleaned the PCB contacts where they are grounded, do so specially in the metal box behind the front panel which houses the PCB for the DSP which can cause birdies if the contacts are not clean.
Put metal pointed washers under all PCB screws to improve grounding contacts after cleaning them up.



All these mods i have PDF files for or can give a good description off.
To do list: get the Inrad roofing filter installed, that will make a very good receiver out of the transceiver.

I owned Yaesu FT 757GX2, Kenwood TS 430 s Line, Yaesu FT 840, i used the FT 1000 (D) and MP versions, FT 2000 with added roofing filter, Icom 756 Pro 3.

The last sets were used here for at least 2 or more weeks for extensive testing.

The FT100 i own has an excellent receiver as well, and with the AM Xfilter it has a very good AM modulation, carrier set on 25 watts and fully modulated 100 watts.
Personally i think the DSP on board of the FT 100 or FT 100 D is a tad better as the FT 847.

But then these are my results as measured on the spectrum analyser, scope, dummy, antenna's and other test gear, some mine, some of a good friend.

Owning the new Hitachi V1100A 4 channel 100 MHz scope will make my measuring and tinker fun just up one notch.
http://www.atecorp.com/Equipment/Hitachi/V1100A.asp

A GOOD ALL AROUND RIG..IF YOU WANT A GREAT HF RIG. FORK OUT THE 10 GRAND
Best advice i read.....:mrgreen:
Even then you miss 2/70 all mode...
The FT 857.897 cannot stand in the shadow of the FT 847....that is my story and I'm sticking to it.

[N2NH]

By the way...love the sigline pic you have there. :agree:

Thanks. I lost a Fender Zone last summer. Thinking of replacing it with a Fender Aerodyne Bass eventually. Also looking for a decent and cheap Hollow Body Bass.

[W1GUH]

Like This?

http://www.ericgarrison.net/images/rickandbassfiddle.jpg

[W1GUH]

Go vintage. A decent TR-7 will cost about $400 - 450 and give you great performance and reliability. Or hollow state -- a TR-3 or TR-4 will do grandly. On a budget? An SB-102 will do. Feeling deluxe? Get a KWM-2.

[N8YX]

Go vintage. A decent TR-7 will cost about $400 - 450 and give you great performance and reliability.

I am going to be listing a filtered-up, NB7 equipped TR7 in the next couple weeks. Islanders get first dibs...

[W1GUH]

I am going to be listing a filtered-up, NB7 equipped TR7 in the next couple weeks. Islanders get first dibs...

There ya go, 'NH!

[WV6Z]

That would be a sweet one indeed John, but, hate to say it..... gotta agree with Fred again (damn...... will Armageddon kick in?!?!) on the FT-847, absolutely awesome rig and often one can be found for slightly under $1k. I actually saw a NIB one for $1.2k and very, very well worth it indeed!

[W1GUH]

That would be a sweet one indeed John, but, hate to say it..... gotta agree with Fred again (damn...... will Armageddon kick in?!?!) on the FT-847, absolutely awesome rig and often one can be found for slightly under $1k. I actually saw a NIB one for $1.2k and very, very well worth it indeed!

If I may stray from the top slightly I want to comment on the TR-7/rice box decision. After doing both, I can't say which one I could do without. The Drake is utterly awesome in what it can do and how it sounds -- that's one very sweet operating and sounding radio in an extremely rugged package. And it's built like a brick shithouse, able to withstand lots of abuse, both electrical and mechanical.

Contrast this with my rice box. ('857) On-air performance (at least in a mobile environment -- the only way I CAN operate) is entirely equivalent plus installation and operation is far more convenient than the Drake. The way I mount its faceplate on the windshield and control it with the remote control mic makes it a very safe mobile installation where I've got 160 - 440 and all the modes, literally, in the palm of my hand. On-air reports are ALWAYS "Great signal for a mobile with good audio." That radio doesn't get babied & so far has been absolutely, 100% reliable.

So which do I like better? Don't have a preference, it's almost pears and cumquats.

OK...back on topic.

[W3WN]

Fred, there are some days I actually... I'd love to have a TR-7 in the shack, but the shekels just aren't there right now.

[N8YX]

Fred, there are some days I actually... I'd love to have a TR-7 in the shack, but the shekels just aren't there right now.

I also take dollars and yuan. :whistle:

[WV6Z]

If I may stray from the top slightly I want to comment on the TR-7/rice box decision. After doing both, I can't say which one I could do without. The Drake is utterly awesome in what it can do and how it sounds -- that's one very sweet operating and sounding radio in an extremely rugged package. And it's built like a brick shithouse, able to withstand lots of abuse, both electrical and mechanical.

Contrast this with my rice box. ('857) On-air performance (at least in a mobile environment -- the only way I CAN operate) is entirely equivalent plus installation and operation is far more convenient than the Drake. The way I mount its faceplate on the windshield and control it with the remote control mic makes it a very safe mobile installation where I've got 160 - 440 and all the modes, literally, in the palm of my hand. On-air reports are ALWAYS "Great signal for a mobile with good audio." That radio doesn't get babied & so far has been absolutely, 100% reliable.

So which do I like better? Don't have a preference, it's almost pears and cumquats.

OK...back on topic.

Can't say enough good about the 857d, ran one mobile for years with never a moments problem or issues. I would have to say it was quite likely the best rig I have ever owned and yes, you heard it from a Kenwood fan. Having had the opportunity to use it's big brother I can honestly say, for everything from HF to satellite functionality, there has likely never been a finer rig $ for $ than the 847. As a stand alone do everything miracle box, the 847 is difficult to surpass, thus my suggesting it to John for something different and special as it would appear he is ready to retire the 817 and 857. The only thing I have seen that could even ever have come close would have been the FT-100d, impossible to surpass, impossible to repair........ :(

[KG4CGC]

the FT-100d, impossible to surpass, impossible to repair........
Yep. Mine makes a hell of a scanner and HF/General receiver. Slaved to the Corsair you can work the widest splits. Ever do HF/440 send/receive? Neither have I but I can if I want to and the station I'm in contact with is monitoring on HF while sending on 440.

[N2NH]

Like This?

http://www.ericgarrison.net/images/rickandbassfiddle.jpg

:lol:

Those are really nice but a bit hard to ride the bus with or carry while on a scooter.

I had a Oscar Schmidt which is supposed to be a nightmare. I was lucky, mine wasn't and had a custom ebony wood fingerboard - got it on eBay for $189 and fixed the twisted neck for $35 more. Really liked it although the pickups weren't really loud. I think Hollowbody's get a bad rap because it's a bit harder to play than a solid body bass, but I really like the tone of the Hollowbody and my hands seem to be able to play it fine.

Looking at this baby for about $250. It's not fullscale and that's about the only drawback...

4183Just wish it came in Red burst or blue Burst. Black basses are as common as weeds.

[W1GUH]

'NH said:


Those are really nice but a bit hard to ride the bus with or carry while on a scooter.


I've always admired bass fiddle players because of that -- must really take dedication. Guess you've seen them with a wheel attached to the piece that sticks out the bottom?

[W7XF]

So far, I'm very impressed with the IC-7000 in the truck...worked a UA the first night out of the box!! I would have never heard him over the noise with the 857D. I'm probably going to relegate the 857 to in-house duty. And, I will probably also add on a SSB filter (Collins?) to the 7000. As if..the filtering is already superior to the 857D. When I spent the afternoon at HRO comparing my final 3 choices (FT 857D, IC 7000 and the TS-480)...the receivers on the Icom and Yaesu are pretty much equal in sensitivity; the TS480 was easily 3-4 S-units lower, even with RX preamp on. It is the superior filtering that got the IC 7000 the nod over the 857D.

ESPECIALLY in a mobile environment, the 7000 shines. But, get a 4" external speaker, whichever one you get.

[KJ3N]

There is no place for an optional filter in a 7000. Learn to work the DSP filters in the radio. You have 3 presets you can adjust.

[KG4CGC]

There is no place for an optional filter in a 7000. Learn to work the DSP filters in the radio. You have 3 presets you can adjust.

I was going say something similar. Like isn't that rig already as loaded as you can make it?

[NQ6U]

There is no place for an optional filter in a 7000. Learn to work the DSP filters in the radio. You have 3 presets you can adjust.

Yep, the filtering is done completely with DSP in the IC-7000

[KG4CGC]

Add a fan on the back and if you're really feeling adventurous, add a separate 7" display.

[N8YX]

Add a fan on the back and if you're really feeling adventurous, add a separate 7" display.

Late-model cars equipped with an in-dash LCD display can hook said display to the Icom. Does it offer a USB video connection in back or is the output VGA?

[KG4CGC]

Late-model cars equipped with an in-dash LCD display can hook said display to the Icom. Does it offer a USB video connection in back or is the output VGA?

From Icom:
2.5 inch color TFT display
The 2.5 inch color TFT display presents numbers and indicators in bright, concentrated colors for easy recognition. You can choose from 3 background colors and 2 font styles to suit your preference, in addition to a large operating frequency readout. And more, the Video output jack on the rear panel allows you to view a magnified display on an external monitor*.
* 3.5(d) mm monaural cable is required for connection.

http://www.icomamerica.com/en/products/amateur/hf/7000/default.aspx

ETA: look at the bottom of the page. Just a simple 1/8th inch plug is all that is required.
News to me, I thought it was VGA or something other than what you see.

[KJ3N]

It's base-band video. NTSC, if I remember correctly.

[KB3LAZ]

In my personal experience I have had zero problems with my 7000 or my pro III. Always excellent audio reports etc. I have owned them for a substantial amount of time now and have always been happy with them. However do understand what you buy. The 7000 itself is a compromised rig in its own right ofc and that should be self explanatory. Note that I did not say that these two radios do not have their faults because like all radios they do. Simply put I got what I paid for and I was happy with the results.

If you want something compact the 7000 is a good rig. otherwise of all radios on the current market of you want something semi compact, built well, full of features, and has 2m+440 then I would go with the TS-2000. Personally I wouldnt buy it because it does not suit my needs or my style but I have used the rig frequently for years and have always been pleased with its overall performance. Peronally Im not too fond of it for HF and I know many will disagree with me however if Im looking for simple desk top opperation I dont like the filtration it offers and its DSP is less than satisfactory with me. However that is just an opinion.

Either the TS-2000 or the 7000 will be to your personal satisfactory if you are looking for a desktop jackknife.

When it comes to the 7k I will list the dissatisfaction I have with it when operating desktop. Spectrum scope is complete trash, it is imo not at all a good rig for am even with mic modifications or even the use of an aftermarket mic, if you like Hi-Fi audio on either AM or SSB interconnecting audio equipment is a strain and can be costly not to mention the market for mics that work well with this rig are slim, and the last thing would be using the rig to work QRO, you will need an external relay (not a big deal), but I personally have found that it is a major strain on the rig to drive an amp (the need to push more watts so to speak without modification) which makes the rig run hot or I should say hotter than usual and it runs hot as it is.

As I said most rigs if not all are compromised in one way or another. It is all going to come down to your personal preference, your needs, and ofc expense. Again, both the 7k and Ts2K are fair priced for what they are and either will server you well depending on your needs.

An aside neither of these rigs were designed for Hi-Fi audio IMO then again like most others if that is what I am looking to do Id stick to the 850, 970, or 950SDX that I sold off long ago.

GL John

[N1LAF]

It's base-band video. NTSC, if I remember correctly.

You remember correctly. Also known as 'composite' video. usually an RCA connector. Portable DVD players use 1/8" plugs

http://paulfelgate.com/hamradio/N1LAF_portable.jpg
For example, we have the 7000 connected to a RCA portable DVD player, using the video input option

[N7YA]

Thats really cool. I like that.

Welcome back, Trav! Ive been away for a bit myself while i moved into a new house...being a ham, you would think that i could figure out a wireless router, but noooooooooooooooooo....

[KB3LAZ]

Thats really cool. I like that.

Welcome back, Trav! Ive been away for a bit myself while i moved into a new house...being a ham, you would think that i could figure out a wireless router, but noooooooooooooooooo....

Aye mate long time no see!

And lol on the router. Oi I have to fix my parents net for them all of the time cuz dad likes to reset the modem lol.

[N7YA]

I had to do a lot of resetting on this router due to 3 adapters throughout the house. But only after i was promted to do so. :)