busted

[W2NAP]

In October 2010, an agent from the FCC’s Enforcement Office visited Monroe, Michigan-based Doctor Radio’s CB Shop to find that the store was selling, among other items, a radio that was described as “an Amateur Radio that could operate on CB frequencies” that was modified to operate above the approved power limits. As such, the FCC issued a Citation to the store on January 4 for marketing unauthorized radio frequency devices in the United States in violation of Section 302(b) of the Communications Act and Section 2.803(a)(1) of the Commission’s rules.

The equipment in question includes a Cobra 150 GTL DX. A store employee explained to an FCC agent that the transceiver had been modified to generate 170 W of power. The store employee further explained that the Cobra 150 GTL DX was an Amateur Radio transceiver that could operate on CB frequencies. If legally operated, the 150 GTL DX operates from 28-29.7 MHz; the CB frequencies are 26.965-27.405 MHz. Section 95.655(a) of the FCC rules prohibit radios that can transmit on both the amateur and CB bands. According to the Citation, the Cobra 150 GTL DX “offered for sale at Doctor Radio had both CB and Amateur Radio capability and therefore cannot be sold in the United States.”

http://www.arrl.org/news/fcc-cites-retailer-for-marketing-amateur-radios-as-cb-radios

never seen a cobra 150GTL DX, but 170 watts! bet thats hard on them finals

[KC2UGV]

Damned right it would be hard on the finals:
http://www.amazon.com/Cobra-150-GTL-DX-10-Meter/dp/B0009EJ9LS

It's only a 20W rig out of the box...

[W5RB]

Musta been "Dosy watts".

[PA5COR]

Must be one heck of an "Golden screwdriver on steroids" trick...

[kb2vxa]

The employee once again proves the tongue makes the best shovel for digging one's own grave. I'd love to have been a fly on the wall as the FCC Field Engineer clucked his tongue and circled his ear with a finger.

[W2NAP]

The employee once again proves the tongue makes the best shovel for digging one's own grave. I'd love to have been a fly on the wall as the FCC Field Engineer clucked his tongue and circled his ear with a finger.

me to.

[KG4CGC]

Pretty useless as a ham rig in my opinion unless the only thing you use it for is FM repeater work and then I have to ask if it does splits.
Geez guys, just get a ham rig. Yeah yeah, I know, CB yada.

[NQ6U]

Pretty useless as a ham rig in my opinion unless the only thing you use it for is FM repeater work and then I have to ask if it does splits.
Geez guys, just get a ham rig. Yeah yeah, I know, CB yada.

Doesn't appear to be able to do splits, nor does it have CTSS tones. It's really only intended for truckers to use illegally on the 10m band, or to be modified to operate on 11m.

[VE7DCW]

Damned right it would be hard on the finals:
http://www.amazon.com/Cobra-150-GTL-DX-10-Meter/dp/B0009EJ9LS

It's only a 20W rig out of the box...

I chalk it up to that value added "super whack pack" after market care :lol:

73

[n2ize]

Well, my old Johnson Viking 2 can transmit on the ham bands and on CB. The VFO and bandswitch both include an 11 meter position. Does that mean i cannot sell it ? Matter of fact it can transmit on the upper end of the AM Bcast band.

[n2ize]

Musta been "Dosy watts".

Huh ???

[N2CHX]

I'm just trying to figure out why the FCC even cares how much power is used on CB frequencies.

[KC2UGV]

Well, my old Johnson Viking 2 can transmit on the ham bands and on CB. The VFO and bandswitch both include an 11 meter position. Does that mean i cannot sell it ? Matter of fact it can transmit on the upper end of the AM Bcast band.

Only if it's on the FCC list.

[NQ6U]

Never tried using my old Icom on the CB frequencies but I bet it will work. It seems to have been opened up by a previous owner. I might try it later--into a dummy load, of course.

[W5RB]

Huh ???

"Bird watts" are measured on a Bird meter , "Dosy watts " are measured on this precision piece of US-made , made for CB , test equipment , which may be , uh , more optimistic .

http://www.dosy.com/img_c/pm1000.jpg

[KG4CGC]

From my river of shit to yours!
I believe that some of the CB meters are more accurate and useful than others depending of the parts available in the factory at the time.

[W5RB]

I hafta confess , I've never had hands on any Dosy gear . I know 'em only by reputation . And the fact that some of their gear will measure either peak or "RMS" watts of RF .

[KG4CGC]

I still have my first meter from Radio Shack. Depending on the diodes that were used, some of the units were accurate up to the 2m band. The RS meter is very accurate on the HF ham bands but my Para-Dynamics meter reads the power output at almost double. Granted, I have not done a proper calibration to test it correctly. Last few hamfests I attended, I saw quite a few Para-Dynamic meters for sale. I thought to myself, "hams use these?" I guess having triple meters in one package certainly looks impressive.

Moral of the story I suppose, buy gear intended for your area of interest. I wish I had that old SWR/FS Radio Shack meter. That thing was pretty neat. I actually used it for a lightening detector for a few seasons.

[W3WN]

Well, my old Johnson Viking 2 can transmit on the ham bands and on CB. The VFO and bandswitch both include an 11 meter position. Does that mean i cannot sell it ? Matter of fact it can transmit on the upper end of the AM Bcast band.Yes, that's absolutely right. You can't sell it.

But I'll tell you what. You can give it away, and I promise I can give it a good home. How much do you want to cover shipping?

...and if I thought you'd actually fall for that, there's a bridge in Brooklyn that you'd already own the deed on...

[KA9MOT]

...and if I thought you'd actually fall for that, there's a bridge in Brooklyn that you'd already own the deed on...

You have a Bridge? How much? I'm very interested! Will you accept any trades? I have a planet I am not using. :lol:

[kb2crk]

Well, my old Johnson Viking 2 can transmit on the ham bands and on CB. The VFO and bandswitch both include an 11 meter position. Does that mean i cannot sell it ? Matter of fact it can transmit on the upper end of the AM Bcast band.

obvious troll is obvious. your johnson comes from a time when 11 meters was a ham band.

the cobra is an obvious CB that is not type approved as such.

your johnson is an amateur radio. and a real heavy boat anchor at that.....

[kd8dey]

You have a Bridge? How much? I'm very interested! Will you accept any trades? I have a planet I am not using. :lol:

Uranus??

[kb2crk]

Uranus??

he needs that to talk out of......lmao

[NQ6U]

Uranus??

http://www.icis.com/blogs/icis-chemicals-confidential/titan%20uranus.jpg

[N8YX]

Moral of the story I suppose, buy gear intended for your area of interest. I wish I had that old SWR/FS Radio Shack meter. That thing was pretty neat. I actually used it for a lightening detector for a few seasons.
I have an R/S (Micronta) watt/modulation/SWR meter which is surprisingly accurate across the whole HF spectrum. It sees frequent use on my test bench. Really ought to buy another from eBay as one of the switches is broken and the Mod Cal knob is missing. Has been for years.

[KC2UGV]

I have an R/S (Micronta) watt/modulation/SWR meter which is surprisingly accurate across the whole HF spectrum. It sees frequent use on my test bench. Really ought to buy another from eBay as one of the switches is broken and the Mod Cal knob is missing. Has been for years.

I've got one for you if you want. I can drop it in the mail monday if you like.

[N8YX]

I've got one for you if you want. I can drop it in the mail monday if you like.
One of these?

http://www.musclecars.net/parts/parts-images-large/micronta-3-meter-cb-radio-power-modulation-swr-tester_130461665436.jpg



Trade ya for a PK-232 (which I still have to check out...) :oops:

[NQ6U]

I bought a mint condition Bird 47 with a faux leather case and seven slugs for $100 from a ham who was leaving town. Deal of a lifetime--I've seen some of the high-power slugs alone going for more than that on eBay.

[KC2UGV]

One of these?

http://www.musclecars.net/parts/parts-images-large/micronta-3-meter-cb-radio-power-modulation-swr-tester_130461665436.jpg

Trade ya for a PK-232 (which I still have to check out...) :oops:


Yep, same one. I'll drop it in the mail Monday or Tuesday for ya if you like. Callook.info information good?

[n2ize]

"Bird watts" are measured on a Bird meter , "Dosy watts " are measured on this precision piece of US-made , made for CB , test equipment , which may be , uh , more optimistic .

http://www.dosy.com/img_c/pm1000.jpg

Oh... ok... I think I have one of those in my junk box. I measure watts in terms of plate current and tube efficiency.

[n2ize]

Yes, that's absolutely right. You can't sell it.

But I'll tell you what. You can give it away, and I promise I can give it a good home. How much do you want to cover shipping?

...and if I thought you'd actually fall for that, there's a bridge in Brooklyn that you'd already own the deed on...

Hah... I highly doubt I can't sell it. But the Viking 2 has too much sentimental value and too much TLC for me to sell it. They'll have to pry it from my cold dead hands.

[N8YX]

Yep, same one. I'll drop it in the mail Monday or Tuesday for ya if you like. Callook.info information good?
If you're going to mail the unit (rather than sending it via UPS or FedEx) I'll PM you my address...

[W5RB]

obvious troll is obvious. your johnson comes from a time when 11 meters was a ham band.

the cobra is an obvious CB that is not type approved as such.

your johnson is an amateur radio. and a real heavy boat anchor at that.....

I was looking for a recent post to cite , but I'm sure I remember one lately saying we shouldn't be maligning other members' Johnsons.
:mrgreen:

[W3WN]

< snip >
Moral of the story I suppose, buy gear intended for your area of interest. I wish I had that old SWR/FS Radio Shack meter. That thing was pretty neat. I actually used it for a lightening detector for a few seasons.
I may have one sitting around. It's buried in the garage right now, as soon as I can get to that box, I'll check. You're welcome to it.

I still have my original LRE SWR bridge from Lafayette. It's one of the few pieces of my original WN2 shack I still have. I don't think I've used it in over 30 years, but it has great sentimental value.

[KG4CGC]

I may have one sitting around. It's buried in the garage right now, as soon as I can get to that box, I'll check. You're welcome to it.

I still have my original LRE SWR bridge from Lafayette. It's one of the few pieces of my original WN2 shack I still have. I don't think I've used it in over 30 years, but it has great sentimental value.
Wow! This is turning into a generous thread and in the CB section even! Who would have thunk? :)

[N2NH]

Well, my old Johnson Viking 2 can transmit on the ham bands and on CB. The VFO and bandswitch both include an 11 meter position. Does that mean i cannot sell it ? Matter of fact it can transmit on the upper end of the AM Bcast band.

That's a good question. From what I heard, any rig made before 40 channels lost type acceptance and is no longer legal, but I've never seen that in writing.

Sure you want to find out? You might be the owner of an illegal radio. :snicker:

[KG4CGC]

I thought that anything made before 1963 was grandfathered.

[kb2crk]

That's a good question. From what I heard, any rig made before 40 channels lost type acceptance and is no longer legal, but I've never seen that in writing.

Sure you want to find out? You might be the owner of an illegal radio. :snicker:

you mean all my 23 channel radios are illegal? oh my, i might get in trouble....

[W3WN]

That's a good question. From what I heard, any rig made before 40 channels lost type acceptance and is no longer legal, but I've never seen that in writing.

Sure you want to find out? You might be the owner of an illegal radio. :snicker:
IIRC, after the cut-over date, it was illegal to manufacture (due to loss of type acceptance) and commercially sell a new 23 channel unit. That would not affect private sales of used equipment.

Same thing happened when the FCC decreed that all TV sets must include the UHF channels, way back when.

[W3WN]

< snip>
Moral of the story I suppose, buy gear intended for your area of interest. I wish I had that old SWR/FS Radio Shack meter. That thing was pretty neat. I actually used it for a lightening detector for a few seasons.
I may have one sitting around. It's buried in the garage right now, as soon as I can get to that box, I'll check. You're welcome to it.

I still have my original LRE SWR bridge from Lafayette. It's one of the few pieces of my original WN2 shack I still have. I don't think I've used it in over 30 years, but it has great sentimental value.

Found the meter I was thinking of, but it's labeled as a "Vanco" as opposed to RS or a RS brand (ie Realistic). And it has a little tape residue that will need cleaned off of it.

But it's still yours, I just have to get it in a box and send it on it's way. Which won't happen tonight, I just got done stuffing the holiday decorations back under the stairs, and we're leaving for a niece's birthday party in a few minutes (so much for having an afternoon off to "do whatever" I want... hah!)

[KG4CGC]

Found the meter I was thinking of, but it's labeled as a "Vanco" as opposed to RS or a RS brand (ie Realistic). And it has a little tape residue that will need cleaned off of it.

But it's still yours, I just have to get it in a box and send it on it's way. Which won't happen tonight, I just got done stuffing the holiday decorations back under the stairs, and we're leaving for a niece's birthday party in a few minutes (so much for having an afternoon off to "do whatever" I want... hah!)
Let me know what interests you. Do you need any empty cigar boxes? I have most all sizes. Some are ornate and some are nice wood tone. All are wood or laminated wood. I may even have some tin types that are flatish but if you cut them up you can use them for RF shielding for small projects. That is about the most useful thing I can think of off the top of my head.
Thank You Very Much :)
PS, let me know and I can at least kick back shipping costs. :)

[KA5PIU]

Hello.

Yes, you can make a 150 do 150.
No, it is not hard on the finals. ;)
The trick is in how you get the 150 watts.
http://www.copper.com/cart/product_info.php?cPath=61&products_id=1424
We are not saying that this is clean watts but just 150 of them. ;)

[W3WN]

Let me know what interests you. Do you need any empty cigar boxes? I have most all sizes. Some are ornate and some are nice wood tone. All are wood or laminated wood. I may even have some tin types that are flatish but if you cut them up you can use them for RF shielding for small projects. That is about the most useful thing I can think of off the top of my head.
Thank You Very Much :)
PS, let me know and I can at least kick back shipping costs. :)
We'll think of something. Don't sweat the small stuff.

[n2ize]

That's a good question. From what I heard, any rig made before 40 channels lost type acceptance and is no longer legal, but I've never seen that in writing.

Sure you want to find out? You might be the owner of an illegal radio. :snicker:

The Viking 2 was made long before there was such thing as CB. In 1952, which is when my Viking 2 was built 11 meters was a Ham band. The Viking 2 would never have been type accepted as a CB rig as it is a 100 watt plate modulated 160-10 meter vfo controlled ham transmitter.

[PA5COR]

You did read the specs Rudi?

5 Amp fuse for 12 volts = 60 watts input, 60% return output for that = 36 watts out, make it 70% for Class C = 42 watts, expecting the fuse to be working at 100% max duty cycle.
Most of the time a good engineer will have some headroom incorporated and use a 5 Amp fuse in a 4 Amp max drawing circuitry.

So, nice try, no cigar.
My 300 watt P.A. with 4 x the MRF 455 will pull 42 amps for 300 watts out. Class A/B
More realistic values, but then i'm just a stupid ham since 1977.




Hello.

Yes, you can make a 150 do 150.
No, it is not hard on the finals. ;)
The trick is in how you get the 150 watts.
http://www.copper.com/cart/product_info.php?cPath=61&products_id=1424
We are not saying that this is clean watts but just 150 of them. ;)

[KA5PIU]

Hello.

It was intended to be sarcastic.
Somehow DOSY watts are more, shall we say, Optimistic than mere Bird watts?
Now, if we do find a way to produce a true 150 watts of RF power, or even 100, and manage to stuff this thing inside a radio, with no heat sink even, remember that this is thin enough to fit without removing the speaker, let me know. ;)
Fact of the matter is that most CB truck driving types are downright dumb when it comes to, well, everything.
Usually very friendly, but not all that smart.
The rest, heavy equipment operators and the like? some can not read, not due to a lack of education, they really are not that smart.
Somebody with an average education can set up a CB shop and make over $100k a year, easy.
That is why even after the FCC comes in and issues the big fines they are still at it.
Kind of like the drug trade.

[n2ize]

I still have my first meter from Radio Shack. Depending on the diodes that were used, some of the units were accurate up to the 2m band. The RS meter is very accurate on the HF ham bands but my Para-Dynamics meter reads the power output at almost double. Granted, I have not done a proper calibration to test it correctly. Last few hamfests I attended, I saw quite a few Para-Dynamic meters for sale. I thought to myself, "hams use these?" I guess having triple meters in one package certainly looks impressive.

Moral of the story I suppose, buy gear intended for your area of interest. I wish I had that old SWR/FS Radio Shack meter. That thing was pretty neat. I actually used it for a lightening detector for a few seasons.

In the old days we'd build our own SWR bridges. I have a homebrew SWR bridge. I also have one of those RS SWR/Watts meters. Also, in the old days high SWR's were not uncommon.

[NQ6U]

In the old days we'd build our own SWR bridges. I have a homebrew SWR bridge. I also have one of those RS SWR/Watts meters. Also, in the old days high SWR's were not uncommon.

In the real old days, before the government dumped a boatload of cheap coax on the surplus market after WW II, most hams fed their antennas with a balanced line and didn't even use SWR meters.

[KG4CGC]

(comment on eating dirt here)

[W3WN]

In the real old days, before the government dumped a boatload of cheap coax on the surplus market after WW II, most hams fed their antennas with a balanced line and didn't even use SWR meters.

... and ended up causing all sorts of TVI to the "new fangled" television receivers coming onto the consumer market, in part due to poor shielding on the part of the manufacturer, in part because so many early TV's used a 21 MHz IF...

[NQ6U]

(comment on eating dirt here)

(comment on saving the rocks for dessert here)

[n2ize]

In the real old days, before the government dumped a boatload of cheap coax on the surplus market after WW II, most hams fed their antennas with a balanced line and didn't even use SWR meters.

Yes, the perfect 1:1 SWR was not important in those good ol' days. High SWR's were considered normal. And they still got out great.

And for the most part (at least on HF) I find balanced line (i.e ladder or even window line) to be far superior to coax. Coax will radiate if its not properly matched where as open wire line can be looking into a large mismatch and as long as the radio is tuned to the antenna it won;t radiate (much) and will carry the signal quite efficiently to the antenna.

I've had some hams try to tell me that open wire line is not efficient and it radiates like crazy. I ask "How ?? its balanced". Then they wonder how come the coax fed wire antenna they bought at the ham store is keeping their signal locked in their backyard while my home brew antenna made of old scrap telegraph wire, homebrew insulators, and fed with balanced line is putting a signal across the country and around the world.

I swear by balanced line on HF. I wouldn't be caught dead using anything else. Only place I use coax is for local in shack jumpers and for feeding VHF/UHF ants.

[NQ6U]

And for the most part (at least on HF) I find balanced line (i.e ladder or even window line) to be far superior to coax.

As usual, there are advantages and disadvantages to both. Balanced line does have less loss than coax and SWR is less of an issue. On the other hand, coax is easier to route since you don't have to worry about keeping away from things that might disturb a surrounding electromagnetic field. Also, it's easier to switch antennas with coax.

Once I have the cash to do so, I'm going to do a compromise set-up: a short coax run from my radio to a balun mounted under the eaves of my shack in our detached garage, then window line from there to the antenna.

[n2ize]

As usual, there are advantages and disadvantages to both. Balanced line does have less loss than coax and SWR is less of an issue. On the other hand, coax is easier to route since you don't have to worry about keeping away from things that might disturb a surrounding electromagnetic field. Also, it's easier to switch antennas with coax.

Once I have the cash to do so, I'm going to do a compromise set-up: a short coax run from my radio to a balun mounted under the eaves of my shack in our detached garage, then window line from there to the antenna.

While it does work I've had bad luck going that route from coax -> balun -> ladder line -> antenna. In short, over time I fried (literallly burned out) my baluns. Now the fact that I'm keying down with minimum 100 watts AM carrier + 100% modulation and making long transmissions could have dramatically shortened the baluns life However, while they lasted they did work. My guess is if your not running AM, i.e if your running CW or SSB you can probably get away with a typical balun.

Preferable is a good link coupled tuner. I use a Johnson 250 watt matchbox. Although its rated at 250 I've run considerably more power into it with no problems whatsoever.It never even so much as arced over. Once it's tuned to the band I'm using it almost never needs adjustment, except when I change bands

A compromise is 450 ohm window line. A lot of guys knock it but I've used it and had great results with it. I have never had trouble routing it. I've run it through metal window frames and past metal louvers with no problems. As long as I don't compress the metal right up against it and as long as I leave a tiny bit of space I have never run into any problems with it. It may not be as great as 600 ohm homebrew ladder line but it is convenient, easily routed, good performance, and, relatively cheap. I 100 foot spool can be had from Universal Radio for under 20 bucks.

BTW a friend of mine actually used 300 ohm TV twin lead as balanced cable and had some good results. Only thing is , with tthe twin lead I wouldn't run too much power into it. But it will handle a typical 100 watt rig with no problemos.

[KA5PIU]

Hello.

Balanced twisted pair works wonders to shield RF.
Even at 6 MHz, the upper frequency of the AT&T U-verse stuff, No RF problems.
At 1.6 MHz, the upper end of normal DSL around here, nothing unless you all but connect the receiver to the line.
Knowing that this is 600 ohm balanced I decided to build a balun for telephone drop cable.
At 10 watts at 444 MHz I get losses that are in line with LMR400.
This is standard single pair copper plated steel wire that was very common in the Bell System.
I am able to salvage this on demolition projects, 500 feet is not uncommon.