NOTAM's...TFR's Apply to Model Aircraft. as well as Full Sized

[n2ize]

We have all heard of TFR's by now. Although they were around for a while they became popularized after 911. For those who don;t know TFR = "Temporary Flight restrictions" involve temporarily restricting or banning the operation of aircraft within a certain zone or region, usually due to a major event (such as the Olympics) or VIP traffic in the area.

What a lot of people aren't aware of is that TFR's also apply to model aircraft and model rockets. Yes, even that remote controlled airplane sitting in the back of your closet that you bought a couple years ago (and never flew because you figured you'd wreck it first shot) is subject to TFR restrictions and cannot be legally flown in your backyard if there is an active TFR in your area. Those Estes model rockets you launched as a kid can not legally be launched during an active TFR.

http://www.modelaircraft.org/membership/clubs/notams.aspx

[w3bny]

Yep! depending on altitude etc. Been reading up on Da-Rules for balloon and kite antennas.

[n2ize]

Yep! depending on altitude etc. Been reading up on Da-Rules for balloon and kite antennas.

In short they probably won't bother you if you're hovering a small 300 or less sized helicopter in your backyard a few feet off the ground (although technically you're not supposed to do that either during a TFR). But if you send up anything bigger at an altitude and they pick it up they may very well confront you. The AMA (Academy of Model Aeronautics)...Model Aviations equivalent of the ARRL, it trying to work with the FAA to assure that the new rules being enacted in 2011 will not impose too many undue restrictions or hardships on the model aviation hobby. A link to the AMA's letter to the DHS can be seen at the link below.

http://www.modelaircraft.org/membership/clubs/notams.aspx

[N8YX]

If we eliminated the terrorists we wouldn't have to implement such silly little restrictions.

[kc7jty]

Home made drones with wing mounted potato guns, all passengers must be irradiated before boarding (bugs, bacteria, etc)

[w3bny]

and here are the rules for kites/balloons/rockets

http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&rgn=div5&view=text&node=14:2.0.1.3.15&idno=14
or..
http://www.chem.hawaii.edu/uham/part101.html
or..
http://www.wireservices.com/n9zrt/kite/FAA-FCC.html (this guy does a bunch of kite antenna stuff!)

[kc7jty]

If we eliminated the terrorists we wouldn't have to implement such silly little restrictions.

Too late now. If the terrorist threat was eliminated tomorrow the present mentality pleases so many it would never be abandoned.

[N8YX]

Too late now. If the terrorist threat was eliminated tomorrow the present mentality pleases so many it would never be abandoned.
QFT, and reinforced by the current Defense Department economic model.

Peace doesn't pay sh!t. War does.

[n2ize]

If we eliminated the terrorists we wouldn't have to implement such silly little restrictions.

True, but that would require addressing the root causes of terrorism... something out great leaders and planners don;t want to do.

[n2ize]

and here are the rules for kites/balloons/rockets

http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&rgn=div5&view=text&node=14:2.0.1.3.15&idno=14
or..
http://www.chem.hawaii.edu/uham/part101.html
or..
http://www.wireservices.com/n9zrt/kite/FAA-FCC.html (this guy does a bunch of kite antenna stuff!)

Interesting. I have also learned that if you fly a model aircraft strictly as a hobby you are more or less excempt from FAA rules, except obeying TFR's and restrictions when operating near airports or where ops might interfere with full scale ops. But... if you use a model aircraft for an sort of commercial purpose, i.e. aerial surveillance, aerial photography, etc. for which you operate under contract or are compensated for such services then the FAA is heavily involved and such operations may require FAA notifications, permits, waivers, etc. I guess at that point they no longer consider it a hobby but rather they look upon it as commercial flight ops. via unmanned aircraft.

[n2ize]

Home made drones with wing mounted potato guns, all passengers must be irradiated before boarding (bugs, bacteria, etc)

Full body scans and pat downs are required.

[KG4CGC]

I think I was a yoot at the dumb young age of 16 and working at a Burger King near a small municipal airport in the late 70s. It was late at night and there was a helium tank there for some event, 50s day and 35 cent whoppers. Some guy had the brilliant idea to fill up a giant garbage bag (5' x 4') with helium and attach about 20' strip of aluminum foil to it and let it go.
Too bad no one had a scanner or even knew what to listen to. Dumbass kids! Don't know what happened or even if there was a radar blip.

I wonder what would happen today? Jet fighter escorts? Doing time at Gitmo? Lockdown of the city?

[W3MIV]

I guess at that point they no longer consider it a hobby but rather they look upon it as commercial flight ops. via unmanned aircraft.

You need to also consider scale of the remotely guided a/c. Your .30 helicopter can't carry much and won't get too far (though I wouldn't suggest launching it in Lafayette Park, Capitol Plaza or on the Mall), but some remotely guided a/c (including those of hobbyist) approach the size of drones.

Model airplane folks are almost always geeks who exist in a universe apart from ours. When they stop by to visit the home planet, they need to be reminded of the Rules. BBIW.

[n2ize]

You need to also consider scale of the remotely guided a/c. Your .30 helicopter can't carry much and won't get too far (though I wouldn't suggest launching it in Lafayette Park, Capitol Plaza or on the Mall),


The Washington DC area is under an indefinite TFR. You can't legally operate a model aircraft within the FTR radius. If you're a modeler living within that area your best bet is to join an approved club that operates out of an approved field at a safe distance well beyond the TFR zone.


but some remotely guided a/c (including those of hobbyist) approach the size of drones.

Fortunately those become rather expensive and beyond the scope of what the typical reckless idiot is willing to spend. Not to mention the construction time and the learning curve.



Model airplane folks are almost always geeks who exist in a universe apart from ours.


The majority of the ones I know are well connected with the everyday world. In one of the clubs I associate with two of the guys are doctors, one is a dentist, at least 3 are teachers, one is a college professor, and another sells bonds. There is also a nun, 2 commercial pilots, a police pilot and 2 cops.


When they stop by to visit the home planet, they need to be reminded of the Rules. BBIW.

Most model airplane folks tend to be extremely safety conscious, sometimes to the point of seeming excessive. Most modelers understand that keeping the hobby safe and keeping accidents to a minimum, and maintaining good relations with the local community. It vital to be courteous and keep things safe if we want to keep the hobby open and free from restrictions. All it takes is a few reckless idiots to cause injury or property damage resulting in lawmakers passing restrictions on the hobby, issuing bans, requiring special permits to protect the public against these "flying menaces". That is why the modeling community frowns upon careless and reckless operators. Fortunately reckless flyers are very far and few between and the hobby enjoys an excellent safety record.

The liklihood of someone using a model aircraft for nefarious purposes is rather low. As long as the modeling community continues to operate as it has for decades, making safety a major concern, I don't think there should be any need for excessive or highly restrictive rules.

[kf0rt]

Model airplane folks are almost always geeks who exist in a universe apart from ours. When they stop by to visit the home planet, they need to be reminded of the Rules. BBIW.

When you say "ours," you're not speaking of the ham radio universe, right?

[KG4CGC]

What was that movie where a guy used an RC car to run along underneath a moving vehicle to blow it up?

[n2ize]

I wonder if birds are required to remain on the ground in an active TFR area ? Aren't birds unmanned ornithropters ?

[W4RLR]

QFT, and reinforced by the current Defense Department economic model.

Peace doesn't pay sh!t. War does. Strategic Air Command used to have the motto "Peace is our profession". They changed it to "WAR is our profession. PEACE is our product."

[kf0rt]

What was that movie where a guy used an RC car to run along underneath a moving vehicle to blow it up?

Don't recall perzactly, but I'm thinking it was a Dirty Harry flick. Dead Pool?

Here ya go (in French):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWGAc01rrW4

[KG4CGC]

Don't recall perzactly, but I'm thinking it was a Dirty Harry flick. Dead Pool?

Here ya go (in French):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWGAc01rrW4Thanks, Rob!
And in the end, we all know that Dirty Harry is bulletproof!

[suddenseer]

I thought this topic would have had a post that begins with "Hello" by now.:dunno:

[NQ6U]

I thought this topic would have had a post that begins with "Hello" by now.:dunno:

Hello.

No, Rudy only plays with real helicopters.

[kf0rt]

Thanks, Rob!
And in the end, we all know that Dirty Harry is bulletproof!

I just LOVE Eastwood flicks, even the old spaghetti westerns. Assume you've seen Gran Torino?

ETA: Got a new Estes rocket on the workbench. Might have to fly again. Bought it a couple weeks ago. Guy at work mentioned the local hobby shop had closed. He wuz wrong. ;)

[W3MIV]

I thought this topic would have had a post that begins with "Hello" by now.:dunno:

Hello



























Happy?

[kd8dey]

If we eliminated the terrorists we wouldn't have to implement such silly little restrictions.

Nuke em till they glow-Shoot em in the dark??

[suddenseer]

http://www.hollywoodmegastore.com/Images/6971_Happy_Dwarf_Standup_683.jpg

[KG4CGC]

I just LOVE Eastwood flicks, even the old spaghetti westerns. Assume you've seen Gran Torino?

ETA: Got a new Estes rocket on the workbench. Might have to fly again. Bought it a couple weeks ago. Guy at work mentioned the local hobby shop had closed. He wuz wrong. ;)
Yep! Caught that one a couple of months ago. The make up crew added extra grizzle. LOL! Not, he was natural.

[NQ6U]

Nuke em till they glow-Shoot em in the dark??

http://i815.photobucket.com/albums/zz79/gyrogeerloose/mushroomcloud.gif

[n2ize]

I thought this topic would have had a post that begins with "Hello" by now.:dunno:

Hello