A B&O question for you gotham boys

[kc7jty]

http://csx.history.railfan.net/maps/b&opas.gif
1957 image
According to my understanding the B&O accessed NYC from Philadelphia via the Reading and possibly other lines but actually had a small amount of their own trackage in the big apple. I also saw a long, high bridge with what looked like B&O signals in I believe a Bruce Springsteen video that may have been in NYC. Any info on any of this?

[kb2vxa]

The only B&O trackage I remember was on Staten Island connected to the CNJ in NJ at Aldene Junction in Cranford and via ferry to Manhattan Island at its West 26th Street Yard and car float dock. The railroad was a phantom in NJ running over the Reading and CNJ. While the SIRT passenger shuttle AKA The Tooterville Trolley continued to operate from St. George to Tottenville the line from Aldene to St. George was abandoned long ago and only recently reopened by NS, the lift bridge at Elizabeth once again is operational. Here's something I thought I'd never see, proof that miracles DO happen.

[N2NH]

http://csx.history.railfan.net/maps/b&opas.gif
1957 image
According to my understanding the B&O accessed NYC from Philadelphia via the Reading and possibly other lines but actually had a small amount of their own trackage in the big apple. I also saw a long, high bridge with what looked like B&O signals in I believe a Bruce Springsteen video that may have been in NYC. Any info on any of this?

The B&O ran shuttle buses that brought passengers across the Hudson River from various places in Manhattan. They were interesting in themselves and unmistakable. But their request to build a 3rd train Station in Manhattan was turned down by the city, so they had no direct access to the city as did their rival, the Pennsylvania RR. Pity. The city could've had access through Staten Island and opened a terminal in Downtown Brooklyn and Downtown Manhattan if they had granted access. This is something they wish they had now.

Here's a pic of one of their buses in front of their offices on Columbus Circle (it looks like the early 60s).
http://www.trainnet.org/Libraries/Lib003/B_O72.JPG

I found a link to a book that claims that during World War I, the B&O ran into Penn Station.
http://books.google.com/books?id=1xFtQGUUaxYC&pg=PA176&lpg=PA176&dq=b+and+o+terminal+in+new+york&source=bl&ots=KR9MQDmRJC&sig=AyM77cEKrLg3EA84O9Mx4EMBO4Y&hl=en&ei=ua1XS8bPGdCztgeK_qC-BA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CBoQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q=b%20and%20o%20terminal%20in%20new%20york&f=false

[kc7jty]

tnx vxa, I wish I knew which music video that rr bridge was in.

[kc7jty]

Here's a pic of one of their buses in front of their offices on Columbus Circle (it looks like the early 60s).
http://www.trainnet.org/Libraries/Lib003/B_O72.JPG
Priceless John

[N2NH]

The only B&O trackage I remember was on Staten Island connected to the CNJ in NJ at Aldene Junction in Cranford and via ferry to Manhattan Island at its West 26th Street Yard and car float dock. The railroad was a phantom in NJ running over the Reading and CNJ. While the SIRT passenger shuttle AKA The Tooterville Trolley continued to operate from St. George to Tottenville the line from Aldene to St. George was abandoned long ago and only recently reopened by NS, the lift bridge at Elizabeth once again is operational. Here's something I thought I'd never see, proof that miracles DO happen.

There has been talk for years that this line would be extended into Brooklyn and from there to the rest of the city via a tunnel under the Narrows. This has gone on so long, that I've become an old man and it still hasn't happened.


Back in 1888 the B&O Railroad announced plans for a tunnel that would continue its Staten Island North Shore line to Brooklyn. Financial problems and approval delays, however, prevented the plan from ever becoming a reality.
http://www.ahherald.com/ferry/2004/fr040219_verrazano.htm

This was an early story dated 1910. http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=9E04E2DA1239E433A25752C3A9619C94 6196D6CF

Here's a more contemporary version. http://www.hatchmott.com/documents/adobe/Mainwaring%20-%20Development%20of%20NY%20Cross%20Harbor%20Freigh t%20Movement%20Study_RETC%202003.pdf

[kc7jty]

I did some reading on the subject and remember seeing the B&O having the use of Pennsy's tunnel into Manhattan until 1926. The bus photo is pre 1960 because they dropped passenger service in April 1958.
This was interesting:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitol_Li ... O_train%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitol_Limited_%28B&O_train%29)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/0c/OP-2599.jpg/260px-OP-2599.jpg
How many eye teeth would one give to go back in time and ride that puppy?
I can see myself in the dining car now, wearing a cloth napkin tucked into my shirt below the chin, chowing down on a few Chesapeake crab cakes.
Even scrapple was on the breakfast menu.

[kc7jty]

BINGO!
Found the Bruce Springsteen video. The bridge I was talking about appears in the beginning of the video and the block signal definately looks like a B&O signal:
http://new.music.yahoo.com/bruce-spring ... p--2161800 (http://new.music.yahoo.com/bruce-springsteen/videos/view/one-step-up--2161800)
Is it your bridge Warren?

[kc7jty]

notice the fine print under the photo:
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=htt ... CAkQ9QEwAA (http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.ronsaari.com/stockImages/newJersey/GoethalsBridgeAndArthurKillVerticalLiftRailroadBri dge.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.ronsaari.com/slideShow.php%3Fgallery%3Dnyc%26image%3DGoethalsBr idgeAndArthurKillVerticalLiftRailroadBridge.jpg%26 selectedImage%3D&h=644&w=800&sz=72&tbnid=ESU7HozNVrLxRM:&tbnh=115&tbnw=143&prev=/images%3Fq%3Drailroad%2Blift%2Bbridge%2Bat%2BEliza beth,%2Bnj%2Bimages&usg=__z7RsL7s3fiWpfu-83m__wcoFGzY=&ei=bghYS_W4LI_8tAOU4PjFBw&sa=X&oi=image_result&resnum=1&ct=image&ved=0CAkQ9QEwAA)

[N8YX]

How many eye teeth would one give to go back in time and ride that puppy?
Approximately 300yds from where I'm sitting at the moment is/was a main rail corridor:

2x B&O/C&O/Chessie/CSX lines; N-S. Now down to one.

2x Erie Lackawanna lines; E-W. Railroad is defunct; one track torn out and the other right of way sold to the Akron-Barberton Belt RWY (more on this in a bit).

2x ABB/AC&Y/W&LE lines - one has been torn out years ago. The former ABB bought one of the E-L right-of-ways in order to extend its trackage rights to Rittman and nearby towns.

As a young kid, I used to sit on the banks of the Ohio Canal and watch the trains...there were as many as 6 at one time on occasion running through the area simultaneously! (Yes, I know "it ain't prototype".) What's more amazing is the amount of abandoned track which was torn out in the 50s and 60's before I moved here; there were at least 8 parallel rail lines run through here at the railroads' heyday. I keep digging around here and there in the woods and find evidence of yet another spur or shunt which has long since been removed, and recently came across photos of an interchange between the mainline B&O northbound route and the ABB line which is roughly 400 yards from it.

Yes, they ran passenger "excursions" on the line:

http://station76.net/abb/images/1501-09.jpg

This accident happened at the crossing near my residence. Off to the right - beyond the passenger car - one can make out some of the trackage which comprised the B&0/ABB interchange. There is another, more detailed photo of the interconnect somewhere on line; I cannot find it at the moment.

http://media.ohio.com/images/hist27cut_2.JPG

[kc7jty]

I rode CSX through Akron a couple times. Got off once and had a couple beers there with some local (home guard) boys under an overpass before moving on. They tried to catch me there but I foiled them.

[kb2vxa]

"BINGO! Found the Bruce Springsteen video. Is it your bridge Warren?"

Being such a brief clip and from such an angle it's really hard to say. There are tanks in that relative location but farther back than they appear from that perspective, depth of field is hard to judge being it depends on the lens. It could have been shot from the bottom end of South Front St. in Elizabeth but I've never been to that end of the street.

Next came a clip of some older Bombardier coaches commonly used by New Jersey Transit but again with such crappy photography it's hard to tell. As an aside, Paul Simon takes us on a tour of the area starting at Terminal A in Newark Airport, through Elizabeth and Union ending up in Springfield along the dreaded Route 22 Jean Shepherd was so fond of (see my tag line quote) in the opening of his vanity flick One Trick Pony. If you happen to catch it, just past Maxon Pontiac the van passes the Union Motor Lodge and its Ravens Nest Lounge where during one of my "something anything" jobs when I was desperate for temporary employment I had the pleasure of meeting up with the Ray Charles Band.

Lest I forget I really should give you all a look at B&O on Staten Island! The yard at Arlington was shared with the Rapid Transit and was the hub of all freight operations, too bad I only have this one photo.

[kc7jty]

Very nice Warren, tnx. Any idea what year the photo was taken?
I believe the Bruce S video is indeed the bridge from Elizabeth to Staten Is.

[N2NH]

I did some reading on the subject and remember seeing the B&O having the use of Pennsy's tunnel into Manhattan until 1926. The bus photo is pre 1960 because they dropped passenger service in April 1958.
This was interesting:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitol_Li ... O_train%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitol_Limited_%28B&O_train%29)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/0c/OP-2599.jpg/260px-OP-2599.jpg
How many eye teeth would one give to go back in time and ride that puppy?
I can see myself in the dining car now, wearing a cloth napkin tucked into my shirt below the chin, chowing down on a few Chesapeake crab cakes.
Even scrapple was on the breakfast menu.

That's one I'd love to take if I could. I'd also like to try the 20th Century/California Zephyr To CA, The Super Chief/Broadway Limited back to NY. Maybe the Blue Comet and the Silver Meteor when it was run by SCL.

[kc7jty]

Sounds good to me. The combo list is near endless. Go back to the late 40s and travel the south saying at a boarding house or Hotel with community meals included every night.
http://www.american-rails-forums.com/AR%20Images/Streamliners/LN_LM_E8b.jpg
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=htt ... CA0Q9QEwAQ (http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.american-rails-forums.com/AR%2520Images/Streamliners/LN_LM_FAb.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.american-rails.com/humming-bird.html&h=374&w=480&sz=216&tbnid=bHAxV6ovSmG8aM:&tbnh=101&tbnw=129&prev=/images%3Fq%3DL%2526N%2BHUMMING%2BBIRD%2BIMAGES&usg=__xrQJis-EiQU2XaXY3recGJxIgtg=&ei=83NiS8sRh8qxA6GRwJ0D&sa=X&oi=image_result&resnum=2&ct=image&ved=0CA0Q9QEwAQ)

[N2NH]

Sounds good to me. The combo list is near endless. Go back to the late 40s and travel the south saying at a boarding house or Hotel with community meals included every night.
http://www.american-rails-forums.com/AR%20Images/Streamliners/LN_LM_E8b.jpg
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=htt ... CA0Q9QEwAQ (http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.american-rails-forums.com/AR%2520Images/Streamliners/LN_LM_FAb.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.american-rails.com/humming-bird.html&h=374&w=480&sz=216&tbnid=bHAxV6ovSmG8aM:&tbnh=101&tbnw=129&prev=/images%3Fq%3DL%2526N%2BHUMMING%2BBIRD%2BIMAGES&usg=__xrQJis-EiQU2XaXY3recGJxIgtg=&ei=83NiS8sRh8qxA6GRwJ0D&sa=X&oi=image_result&resnum=2&ct=image&ved=0CA0Q9QEwAQ)

There's something to be said for taking a full vista-dome train into some of the remotest areas of the country, through the Rockies in places where they still can't build roads and just enjoying the scenery... Heck, they even had Zephyrettes.
http://calzephyr.railfan.net/zephyrette/zephyrettepm50-0.jpg

Or a train that you could board in New York and never leave your car until you arrived on the west coast, complete with room service... (http://www.american-rails.com/20th-century-limited.html)

http://i47.tinypic.com/2unu4gw.jpg